OOTP Developments Forums - View Single Post - OOTP10 Suggestions: Game Engine / Player Modeling and Development

Buane · 10-21-2008, 11:01 AM

Suggestion

"Contact" rating should no longer be an amalgamation of Avoiding Strikeouts, Homerun Power, and BABIP ratings, but rather just a straight representation of the BABIP rating.

Reason

It makes more sense than the current system. I understand the thought process behind the way it is set up now, but it seems unnecessarily redundant. Currently, a player's Contact rating is made up of a hidden BABIP rating, the player's Avoid Strikeouts rating, and the player's Homerun Power rating. In other words, the game is predicting how the player will be affected by balls in play rather than just telling us straight up.

I know that's worded kind of strangely, so I'll make a longer example to try and make my point. Let's take a fictional player, Bob Jones. Bob Jones' potential talent ratings are 7/7/7/6/10 (C/GP/HR/BB/K format). Now in the current system, Bob Jones' Contact rating looks passable at 7. But if you know how the Contact rating works currently, Bob Jones' Contact rating is actually his weakness, because his other stats say it should be higher. Because his Homerun Power and Avoid Strikeouts ratings are so good, we can assume that his hidden BABIP rating is quite low.

But instead of giving us this hidden rating, the game predicts how Bob Jones is going to perform. It deceives us into thinking Jones is better than he is - yes, he's almost never going to strikeout and he has decent power, but he also has trouble hitting the ball squarely. I understand the need to have a BABIP rating - some players are just better line drive hitters than others - but I don't think the player rating system is entirely straightforward in these instances. If you change the system to one where Contact simply is the displayed BABIP rating, then Bob Jones ratings would look like this: 5/7/7/6/10. From this, it would be much easier to identify the kind of hitter Mr. Jones is going to be one day - a player who's almost never going to strikeout, a player with decent power when he gets ahold of one, but a player who also has a lot of trouble hitting the ball squarely.

You might argue that this kind of system sells Mr. Jones short. Who's going to want a player with a 5 in Contact? Well, under a new ratings display system, it would be our talent evaluating that would have to change.
Yes, Bob Jones' Contact is very low. That means he's likely going to have a lower than average BABIP for his career. But he'll be helped out by the fact that 1) he does have some homerun power so he can produce without having to worry about the ball in play, and 2) he has an extremely high avoid strikeouts rating, so his actual batting average will be helped out by the fact that despite his low BABIP compared to the league, he'll be putting more balls in play than the league (not striking out) and so in the long run he has a good chance to amass just as many hits as a player with a better BABIP rating but whom also strikeout more than Mr. Jones.

I imagine there are quite a few people out there who don't even understand how Contact is calculated. They probably know nothing about the BABIP stat, or why players who look like they should be doing very well are struggling to post a .260 average.

You also have to consider the different league totals that are out there. In a league where homeruns are scarce, Player A, with ratings of 8/7/4/7/5 will likely outperform or equal the performance of Player B, with ratings of 7/7/9/7/7. The system I'm arguing in favor of wouldn't change the results of a league, or the statistics of any player. In the new system, Player A would have ratings closer to 10/7/4/7/5, and Player B 5/7/9/7/7. Both players actual on-field production wouldn't change, just the way their talents are displayed. Now people would be able to accurately judge the relative performances of these two players better.

So to summarize, the current system takes liberties with the Contact rating that are confusing and sometimes misleading. The hidden BABIP rating is already there, and it should be shown to us. The players, the managers out there should have it left to themselves to make their own evaluations instead of the game making its own arbitrary ones. Honestly, if you're going to have a player's rating based on his other ratings, why doesn't having a high Eye/Discipline cause the rest of the player's ratings to go up? Having a good eye would help you make better contact, hit more homeruns, and strikeout less since you'd be swinging at the most hittable pitches. In the end, I think the simplest display would be best, and that's letting us see the player's true ratings and making our own assessments.

Thanks for reading.

Priority

Quite high for me!

10-21-2008, 11:01 AM	#14 (permalink)
Buane Minors (Single A) Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 98 Thanks: 7 Thanked 42x in 11 posts	Suggestion "Contact" rating should no longer be an amalgamation of Avoiding Strikeouts, Homerun Power, and BABIP ratings, but rather just a straight representation of the BABIP rating. Reason It makes more sense than the current system. I understand the thought process behind the way it is set up now, but it seems unnecessarily redundant. Currently, a player's Contact rating is made up of a hidden BABIP rating, the player's Avoid Strikeouts rating, and the player's Homerun Power rating. In other words, the game is predicting how the player will be affected by balls in play rather than just telling us straight up. I know that's worded kind of strangely, so I'll make a longer example to try and make my point. Let's take a fictional player, Bob Jones. Bob Jones' potential talent ratings are 7/7/7/6/10 (C/GP/HR/BB/K format). Now in the current system, Bob Jones' Contact rating looks passable at 7. But if you know how the Contact rating works currently, Bob Jones' Contact rating is actually his weakness, because his other stats say it should be higher. Because his Homerun Power and Avoid Strikeouts ratings are so good, we can assume that his hidden BABIP rating is quite low. But instead of giving us this hidden rating, the game predicts how Bob Jones is going to perform. It deceives us into thinking Jones is better than he is - yes, he's almost never going to strikeout and he has decent power, but he also has trouble hitting the ball squarely. I understand the need to have a BABIP rating - some players are just better line drive hitters than others - but I don't think the player rating system is entirely straightforward in these instances. If you change the system to one where Contact simply is the displayed BABIP rating, then Bob Jones ratings would look like this: 5/7/7/6/10. From this, it would be much easier to identify the kind of hitter Mr. Jones is going to be one day - a player who's almost never going to strikeout, a player with decent power when he gets ahold of one, but a player who also has a lot of trouble hitting the ball squarely. You might argue that this kind of system sells Mr. Jones short. Who's going to want a player with a 5 in Contact? Well, under a new ratings display system, it would be our talent evaluating that would have to change. Yes, Bob Jones' Contact is very low. That means he's likely going to have a lower than average BABIP for his career. But he'll be helped out by the fact that 1) he does have some homerun power so he can produce without having to worry about the ball in play, and 2) he has an extremely high avoid strikeouts rating, so his actual batting average will be helped out by the fact that despite his low BABIP compared to the league, he'll be putting more balls in play than the league (not striking out) and so in the long run he has a good chance to amass just as many hits as a player with a better BABIP rating but whom also strikeout more than Mr. Jones. I imagine there are quite a few people out there who don't even understand how Contact is calculated. They probably know nothing about the BABIP stat, or why players who look like they should be doing very well are struggling to post a .260 average. You also have to consider the different league totals that are out there. In a league where homeruns are scarce, Player A, with ratings of 8/7/4/7/5 will likely outperform or equal the performance of Player B, with ratings of 7/7/9/7/7. The system I'm arguing in favor of wouldn't change the results of a league, or the statistics of any player. In the new system, Player A would have ratings closer to 10/7/4/7/5, and Player B 5/7/9/7/7. Both players actual on-field production wouldn't change, just the way their talents are displayed. Now people would be able to accurately judge the relative performances of these two players better. So to summarize, the current system takes liberties with the Contact rating that are confusing and sometimes misleading. The hidden BABIP rating is already there, and it should be shown to us. The players, the managers out there should have it left to themselves to make their own evaluations instead of the game making its own arbitrary ones. Honestly, if you're going to have a player's rating based on his other ratings, why doesn't having a high Eye/Discipline cause the rest of the player's ratings to go up? Having a good eye would help you make better contact, hit more homeruns, and strikeout less since you'd be swinging at the most hittable pitches. In the end, I think the simplest display would be best, and that's letting us see the player's true ratings and making our own assessments. Thanks for reading. Priority Quite high for me!