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djday45 · 11-24-2008, 10:40 AM

Ok here is Marciano first as a prime then in brackets any ammendments i might make to model him having a 2 or 3 year lay off.

STANCE - Left Handed. I strongly feel a way to make Rocky in the game the rampaging monster who was a nightmare for skilled boxers to face is to give him a tick in this rating. He was well known to be unorthadox and awkward in the extreme, in the beginning this was just him being unskilled and brutish but Weill managed to make it a big plus by the time he was a contender. Punching from weird, if not totally wrong angles Rocky was a nightmare to predict and defend against. You guys know I like to use this category to represent special style factors which have an effect on an opponent.

STYLE - Sluuger. Doh

FOULS - Often. He was a dirty, dirty fighter and im very surprised, if not amazed that he did not lose a fight by DQ. (its quite possible you could change this rating to frequently to represent both his mistiming of his punches and also the growing frustration when he realises his skills are not the same in fights as they were and this realisation kicks in)

FIGHT INSIDE -4. A total monster inside one of the great heavies at this strategy. (3). Maybe reduce it down one to represent him not being able to to quite what he once did.

FIGHTING OUTSIDE - 1. He was not really able to change his style to a boxer, his instincts took over.

COVER UP -1. As above, as with many great punchers he was just so unused to going on the defensive he was bad at it.

GOING FOR KNOCKOUT -4. Again he was simply superb at this, its where he lived. His whole aim was to take out his opponent. (3). Again think seriously of taking this down a notch after his layoff, good way of showing rust.

CLINCHING -73. Really not a mover apart from cutting off the ring, he often mauled inside however. (75). take away some more movement and make him maul even more so. fighters after layoffs lose their legs first in most cases.

DRAW POWER -10. This is a given, an amazingly popular fighter.

CONDITIONING - 1. One of the best conditioned fighters in history. (7) Depends on how your doing his comeback, if its only a single fight make him inactive, if a slow continued comeback then maybe start with a 7 then cycle through 4,3,2 every few fights to represent him slowly making progress and getting back to his former self, i would stop at a 2 so it shows he cant quite get back to his glory days of fitness.

INTELLECT - 6. Not an amazingly thinking fighter his stratergies didnt need to be to be honest.

CONTROL VS BOXER 12. he always had more probs with movers as is quite classic with his style he was nearest to defeat against Walcott and La Starza.
(10). This should take a big hit after the comeback. they would seem even faster and out of reach to him after 2 or 3 years off.

CONTROL VS SLUGGER -15. He is totally on the plateau with Foreman, Dempsey and Louis vs sluggers. a total wrecker of a fighter against guys who could not get out of the way. (14) this would take a small hit after the comeback but not so much as against boxers.

CHIN VS KNOCKDOWN -1. He had an amazing chin and was down only a couple of times in his career and always got back up. (2). This would suffer slightly after the comeback, every couple of years I would degrade it again. see what happened to james jeffries.

CHIN VS KNOCKOUT -0. See above, he truly was a rock of a man. I would not degrade this after the comeback, he would still keep getting up and taking a beating, not a good thing for his health.

RECOVERY -0. He had amazing powers of recovery, one of the best in division history. (2) I would degrade this two streps for the comeback again see Jeffries as the model as to what could happen.

RESISTANCE TO CUTS -3. He bled often and sometimes very badly, again in the modern era I really feel he would have not been undefeated, he would have lost both on cuts maybe multiple times and on DQ. (4) His scar tissue would have got worse, he would have bled even more easily.

ABSORB PUNISHMENT 1. This is a no brainer he was one of the most courageous heavyweights ever, period.

KILLER INSTINCT -10. A great, great finisher totally ruthless. (8) I feel this would be affected, his reactions would be dulled and his speed would effect his finishing ability.

AGRESSIVNESS -10. A total bull coming foward he would dominate and take the ceter of the ring against nearly all heavies.

ENDURANCE -10. He had amazing stamina durig his prime years and was just s dangerous in the championship rounds as early in the fight. (9). He would take a small hit here jsut to represent the effect on his body of aging and lack of training.

DEFENSE +4. His big weakness is here. He got hit a lot, sometimes an awful lot, really he never developed a good defense other than his offense. (+6). If I could make this worse i would, this is where all comebacks fighters are normally never the same, their reflexes.

HITTING POWER -13. One of the hardest hitting heavies in history, his blows here like sledgehammers especially his right hand Suzy Q. (12) A slight degrade, to represent his loss of snap and timing not a degrade in real power.

PUNCHING -40. He wasant particuarly accurate fast or skilled but oh my god the sheer volume of punches. (36) Again this would take a big hit, the volume would be the same but the timing would be often woefully off.

COUNTER PUNCHING - 36. See above in no way a counterer. (32) This again would take a big drop, its always the speed timing and reflexes which go out of the window, they can see the opportuities they just cant take them.

PUNCHES MISSED - 64. Due to his punching style of high volume he was always going to waste punches. (66) even more so after the comeback.

OVERALL RATING - 13. A true all time great.

11-24-2008, 10:40 AM	#138 (permalink)
djday45 All Star Starter Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 1,474 Thanks: 3 Thanked 19x in 12 posts	Rocky Marciano Ok here is Marciano first as a prime then in brackets any ammendments i might make to model him having a 2 or 3 year lay off. STANCE - Left Handed. I strongly feel a way to make Rocky in the game the rampaging monster who was a nightmare for skilled boxers to face is to give him a tick in this rating. He was well known to be unorthadox and awkward in the extreme, in the beginning this was just him being unskilled and brutish but Weill managed to make it a big plus by the time he was a contender. Punching from weird, if not totally wrong angles Rocky was a nightmare to predict and defend against. You guys know I like to use this category to represent special style factors which have an effect on an opponent. STYLE - Sluuger. Doh FOULS - Often. He was a dirty, dirty fighter and im very surprised, if not amazed that he did not lose a fight by DQ. (its quite possible you could change this rating to frequently to represent both his mistiming of his punches and also the growing frustration when he realises his skills are not the same in fights as they were and this realisation kicks in) FIGHT INSIDE -4. A total monster inside one of the great heavies at this strategy. (3). Maybe reduce it down one to represent him not being able to to quite what he once did. FIGHTING OUTSIDE - 1. He was not really able to change his style to a boxer, his instincts took over. COVER UP -1. As above, as with many great punchers he was just so unused to going on the defensive he was bad at it. GOING FOR KNOCKOUT -4. Again he was simply superb at this, its where he lived. His whole aim was to take out his opponent. (3). Again think seriously of taking this down a notch after his layoff, good way of showing rust. CLINCHING -73. Really not a mover apart from cutting off the ring, he often mauled inside however. (75). take away some more movement and make him maul even more so. fighters after layoffs lose their legs first in most cases. DRAW POWER -10. This is a given, an amazingly popular fighter. CONDITIONING - 1. One of the best conditioned fighters in history. (7) Depends on how your doing his comeback, if its only a single fight make him inactive, if a slow continued comeback then maybe start with a 7 then cycle through 4,3,2 every few fights to represent him slowly making progress and getting back to his former self, i would stop at a 2 so it shows he cant quite get back to his glory days of fitness. INTELLECT - 6. Not an amazingly thinking fighter his stratergies didnt need to be to be honest. CONTROL VS BOXER 12. he always had more probs with movers as is quite classic with his style he was nearest to defeat against Walcott and La Starza. (10). This should take a big hit after the comeback. they would seem even faster and out of reach to him after 2 or 3 years off. CONTROL VS SLUGGER -15. He is totally on the plateau with Foreman, Dempsey and Louis vs sluggers. a total wrecker of a fighter against guys who could not get out of the way. (14) this would take a small hit after the comeback but not so much as against boxers. CHIN VS KNOCKDOWN -1. He had an amazing chin and was down only a couple of times in his career and always got back up. (2). This would suffer slightly after the comeback, every couple of years I would degrade it again. see what happened to james jeffries. CHIN VS KNOCKOUT -0. See above, he truly was a rock of a man. I would not degrade this after the comeback, he would still keep getting up and taking a beating, not a good thing for his health. RECOVERY -0. He had amazing powers of recovery, one of the best in division history. (2) I would degrade this two streps for the comeback again see Jeffries as the model as to what could happen. RESISTANCE TO CUTS -3. He bled often and sometimes very badly, again in the modern era I really feel he would have not been undefeated, he would have lost both on cuts maybe multiple times and on DQ. (4) His scar tissue would have got worse, he would have bled even more easily. ABSORB PUNISHMENT 1. This is a no brainer he was one of the most courageous heavyweights ever, period. KILLER INSTINCT -10. A great, great finisher totally ruthless. (8) I feel this would be affected, his reactions would be dulled and his speed would effect his finishing ability. AGRESSIVNESS -10. A total bull coming foward he would dominate and take the ceter of the ring against nearly all heavies. ENDURANCE -10. He had amazing stamina durig his prime years and was just s dangerous in the championship rounds as early in the fight. (9). He would take a small hit here jsut to represent the effect on his body of aging and lack of training. DEFENSE +4. His big weakness is here. He got hit a lot, sometimes an awful lot, really he never developed a good defense other than his offense. (+6). If I could make this worse i would, this is where all comebacks fighters are normally never the same, their reflexes. HITTING POWER -13. One of the hardest hitting heavies in history, his blows here like sledgehammers especially his right hand Suzy Q. (12) A slight degrade, to represent his loss of snap and timing not a degrade in real power. PUNCHING -40. He wasant particuarly accurate fast or skilled but oh my god the sheer volume of punches. (36) Again this would take a big hit, the volume would be the same but the timing would be often woefully off. COUNTER PUNCHING - 36. See above in no way a counterer. (32) This again would take a big drop, its always the speed timing and reflexes which go out of the window, they can see the opportuities they just cant take them. PUNCHES MISSED - 64. Due to his punching style of high volume he was always going to waste punches. (66) even more so after the comeback. OVERALL RATING - 13. A true all time great.