First OOTP 9 Screenshots!!

[SDtwin]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

That's exactly what I coded yesterday

Yay! Now if only he could code a button that would order me dinner so I wouldn't have to get up from the computer

In all seriousness, it's nice to see someone who listens and cares about the community enough to give them what they ask for (within reason)

[Treches]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

Just wondering if you've ever played Fm 2008?? The scope and depth of it is amazing. Why would you not want OOTP to be the FM of baseball sims? Not to turn this into a 6.5 vs. whatever debate, but why would you bring up something that is clearly in the past, and simply not a direction the game should or will be going in?

One thing to have in mind about FM or any other football game is that they don't have to deal with statistical realism because, well, other than goals and, to some extent, assists, stats aren't tracked down in football. Therefore, no hardcore chap would go berserk if Joe Spacefiller compiles 4000 tackles during the year instead of, say, 1500, because he doesn't know how many tackles did Joe Spacefiller pile up to start with. Imagine how much deepness Markus could add to his game if he only had to care about keeping home runs realistic, stats-wise. On the other hand, they don't have to babysit stuff like PBP, historical play, etc. FM is a very deep game, sure, but also rigid and one that moves like a mammoth. OOTP is also deep and way more customizable than FM, but has kind of inherited its mammothian side and the less-than-organized interface. I think the merger was good overall for OOTP, but also took away some of its baseball appeal by implementing features that should have seen the light way down the road, if ever, while passing to enhance some that I think had to have preference.

[cuervo72]

Thanks Markus.

[Gerry58]

Originally Posted by Treches

One thing to have in mind about FM or any other football game is that they don't have to deal with statistical realism because, well, other than goals and, to some extent, assists, stats aren't tracked down in football. Therefore, no hardcore chap would go berserk if Joe Spacefiller compiles 4000 tackles during the year instead of, say, 1500, because he doesn't know how many tackles did Joe Spacefiller pile up to start with.

That's exactly the reason why i stopped playing FM: midfielders passing the ball 100 + times a game.

Gerry

[Gerry58]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Don't worry... Feature-wise, I think we add more features for new versions than any other company doing sports games, and it's not even close.

Thanks, the game is great and i'll buy the next version.

How about the trade AI? Have you improved it?

Gerry

[PSUColonel]

It's not so much stats I'm talking about. It's immersion. The game covers almost every area of what a real manager faces not just on the field, but also off. Players, staff, owners, media, and fans all have dynamic personalities that come to life base on the very decisions you make. For instance, any given payer's character matters in how he interacts with his teammates and how that that transcends onto the field. Player personalities in OOTP feel a bit too much like numbers. Now I know they are likely based on numbers in FM too, but those numbers are concealed, and in place you must find out through the natural progression of time and interaction what the personality of your players are. The scouting system is so well done I can't even get into it. You can build and expand stadiums too. You are constantly getting feedback from owners. You can make requests of those owners. You can also give team talks. From a strategy standpoint wouldn't it be cool if we as baseball managers could set strategies for each individual batter based on hit charts our scouts have compiled and then make decisions such as where exactly on the field to play our second baseman, which way to shift our CF? You laugh, but this is the kind of strategy and depth FM provides for soccer. These examples only touch the iceberg of what this game can do. As far as the interface, with this kind of depth, I would argue it is well organized and very easy to use, once you learn how to use it. The real problem is, many people don't want to learn how to use it, or the nuances of the game for that matter. But I humbly submit this, once you learn it, it is very rewarding and fun, and dare I say the game becomes as addictive as liquid crack. All I am saying is, it seems like there are people around here, who don't want to see the game take on this form, and after playing FM, I think they would be crazy not to want to see it get to this level. I hate soccer, but FM is soooo well done and deep, that it doesn't even matter. Don't we want that for OOTP and baseball?

[Treches]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

It's not so much stats I'm talking about. It's immersion. The game covers almost every area of what a real manager faces not just on the field, but also off. Players, staff, owners, media, and fans all have dynamic personalities that come to life base on the very decisions you make. For instance, any given payer's character matters in how he interacts with his teammates and how that that transcends onto the field. Player personalities in OOTP feel a bit too much like numbers. Now I know they are likely based on numbers in FM too, but those numbers are concealed, and in place you must find out through the natural progression of time and interaction what the personality of your players are. The scouting system is so well done I can't even get into it. You can build and expand stadiums too. You are constantly getting feedback from owners. You can make requests of those owners. You can also give team talks. From a strategy standpoint wouldn't it be cool if we as baseball managers could set strategies for each individual batter based on hit charts our scouts have compiled and then make decisions such as where exactly on the field to play our second baseman, which way to shift our CF? You laugh, but this is the kind of strategy and depth FM provides for soccer. These examples only touch the iceberg of what this game can do. As far as the interface, with this kind of depth, I would argue it is well organized and very easy to use, once you learn how to use it. The real problem is, many people don't want to learn how to use it, or the nuances of the game for that matter. But I humbly submit this, once you learn it, it is very rewarding and fun, and dare I say the game becomes as addictive as liquid crack. All I am saying is, it seems like there are people around here, who don't want to see the game take on this form, and after playing FM, I think they would be crazy not to want to see it get to this level. I hate soccer, but FM is soooo well done and deep, that it doesn't even matter. Don't we want that for OOTP and baseball?

I know that you aren't talking about stats, but I wasn't either. What I tried to explain is that FM, which is roughly 5 years older than OOTP, didn't have to deal with statistical realism (or online play or historical play or even next version's compatibility with previous iterations), thus leaving its developers more time to explore and implement all the stuff that makes the game be so immersive. OOTP, on the contrary, would be a joke if it had all those goodies but spit unrealistic stats. Also, OOTP's flexibility offers pretty much endless playing scenarios but, I'm afraid, also gives endless coding headaches.

Would I like FM's assets into OOTP? As long as they don't turn OOTP into a second, yet unpaid, job for the customer, of course. There's plenty OOTP could copy from FM, no question about that. Still, I would not implement everything that makes FM a great game (like many seem to believe), because not everything that works for a football game may work for a baseball sim.

[truthserum]

SiON logo in 1st screenshot?

[PSUColonel]

I agree with what you are saying, and much of it comes down to the way certain features are implemented as well. For instance, the scouting system in Fm, does not really require too much micromanagement, yet you can still scout individual players, and your head scout will automatically scout your upcoming opponent without you having to tell him to. His report is not just a bunch of numbers either. He gives his opinion of how your opponent stacks up with your team, he also points out players to be aware of, etc...Now I look at the newest screenshot for scouting(and I can't judge completely yet)but based on what I see, it seems as though scouting is going back to a one scout system, where every player in the game gets scouted once a year regardless, and the accuracy of that scouting is simply determined by the scout's ratings and the amount of budget allocation you put into that particular field.(majors, minors, etc) To me this is going back to absolutely simplicity if it is the case. Another way it could be done, is to still have a staff(because let's face it, it's more realistic), but you deal only with the Director of scouting, give him specific orders, and he in turn manages the scouting staff. To me this would be a better way to implement it because it maintains reality and depth, without making you micromanage the task of every scout on staff. As a result of this, you might be able to have a very lengthy list of tasks you could potentially give your scouting staff(scout players, teams, organizations, colleges, international, etc..), which in turn would also create a more realistic environment. Now again, I don't know exactly how the new system is going to work, but I'm strangely suspicious I am right about what I said. I hope I am wrong.

[zekester91]

Originally Posted by truthserum

SiON logo in 1st screenshot?

Yes, it is, but, just a guess, they are waiting the results of the poll to create the new logo for there.

[ctorg]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

I agree with what you are saying, and much of it comes down to the way certain features are implemented as well. For instance, the scouting system in Fm, does not really require too much micromanagement, yet you can still scout individual players, and your head scout will automatically scout your upcoming opponent without you having to tell him to. His report is not just a bunch of numbers either. He gives his opinion of how your opponent stacks up with your team, he also points out players to be aware of, etc...Now I look at the newest screenshot for scouting(and I can't judge completely yet)but based on what I see, it seems as though scouting is going back to a one scout system, where every player in the game gets scouted once a year regardless, and the accuracy of that scouting is simply determined by the scout's ratings and the amount of budget allocation you put into that particular field.(majors, minors, etc) To me this is going back to absolutely simplicity if it is the case. Another way it could be done, is to still have a staff(because let's face it, it's more realistic), but you deal only with the Director of scouting, give him specific orders, and he in turn manages the scouting staff. To me this would be a better way to implement it because it maintains reality and depth, without making you micromanage the task of every scout on staff. As a result of this, you might be able to have a very lengthy list of tasks you could potentially give your scouting staff(scout players, teams, organizations, colleges, international, etc..), which in turn would also create a more realistic environment. Now again, I don't know exactly how the new system is going to work, but I'm strangely suspicious I am right about what I said. I hope I am wrong.

The new scouting system looks very close to one I suggested some time ago, so naturally I'm pretty happy with it if it is.

To me, I think the scouting director really should be the only one you deal with. I think having all the scouts to hire is unnecessary. Just give the scouting director money and let him hire the scouts, and you never even really have to know their names.

To me, hiring individual scouts was the equivalent of setting the price of hot dogs or, maybe more directly, hiring a media relations manager or something. In real life, a team has many, many scouts all over the place. Replicating that would be a waste of game resources. I think you get diminishing returns as you get more detailed, and this is one area that needed to be trimmed back a bit. I can understand why others might disagree, but I've found the current scouting system to be completely unusable.

[silvam14]

Originally Posted by ctorg

The new scouting system looks very close to one I suggested some time ago, so naturally I'm pretty happy with it if it is.

To me, I think the scouting director really should be the only one you deal with. I think having all the scouts to hire is unnecessary. Just give the scouting director money and let him hire the scouts, and you never even really have to know their names.

To me, hiring individual scouts was the equivalent of setting the price of hot dogs or, maybe more directly, hiring a media relations manager or something. In real life, a team has many, many scouts all over the place. Replicating that would be a waste of game resources. I think you get diminishing returns as you get more detailed, and this is one area that needed to be trimmed back a bit. I can understand why others might disagree, but I've found the current scouting system to be completely unusable.

I agree with this post! Managing all of the scouts proved to be just too much for me in previous versions, so I just turned them off.

[rdomico]

Originally Posted by silvam14

I agree with this post! Managing all of the scouts proved to be just too much for me in previous versions, so I just turned them off.

I do like the new scouting design better. With the old version, you had the same number of scouts whether you had a 2 team league or a 40 team league. When I used small leagues, I just sent them off to scout overseas because I couldn't think of enough stuff for them to do. In larger leagues, I was constantly micromanaging to get everything scouted.. Now we just set the budget and play. I like that.

[hydrostar]

Originally Posted by ctorg

The new scouting system looks very close to one I suggested some time ago, so naturally I'm pretty happy with it if it is.

To me, I think the scouting director really should be the only one you deal with. I think having all the scouts to hire is unnecessary. Just give the scouting director money and let him hire the scouts, and you never even really have to know their names.

To me, hiring individual scouts was the equivalent of setting the price of hot dogs or, maybe more directly, hiring a media relations manager or something. In real life, a team has many, many scouts all over the place. Replicating that would be a waste of game resources. I think you get diminishing returns as you get more detailed, and this is one area that needed to be trimmed back a bit. I can understand why others might disagree, but I've found the current scouting system to be completely unusable.

I concur with this, also. Good post.

[PSUColonel]

the problem is, under this system It seems as soon as you hire a director, every player in the league is automatically scouted, done....not realistic or very fun for that matter. Will it take time to scout the various leagues? It doesn't seem so. Will you have a list of tasks that your scouting department is working on at any given time? It doesn't seem so. I agree with what you are all saying, but I just don't think it was implemented in a way that was very immersive. It's just simply functional, and that's about it....at least from what I can see. I could be wrong though. I think maybe you would have had to play FM 2008 to understand what I mean. It's simple enough that it doesn't require micromanagement, but not so simple that you lose the immersion factor.

One other note...it also appears that Scouting Directors also may not be able to take on other j obs because they are now only rated for scouting.


Here is an example of what I'm talking about:









Here is another cool one: A training profile in each player's card

[silvam14]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

the problem is, under this system It seems as soon as you hire a director, every player in the league is automatically scouted, done....not realistic or very fun for that matter. Will it take time to scout the various leagues? It doesn't seem so. Will you have a list of tasks that your scouting department is working on at any given time? It doesn't seem so. I agree with what you are all saying, but I just don't think it was implemented in a way that was very immersive. It's just simply functional, and that's about it....at least from what I can see. I could be wrong though. I think maybe you would have had to play FM 2008 to understand what I mean. It's simple enough that it doesn't require micromanagement, but not so simple that you lose the immersion factor.

One other note...it also appears that Scouting Directors also may not be able to take on other j obs because they are now only rated for scouting.

If you look at it as your scouting director managing all of your scouts and reporting back to you one report (which is realistic enough IMO) then this works. You are setting your financial and scouting priorities and letting the director do the rest.

[Erik W.]

Originally Posted by ctorg

The new scouting system looks very close to one I suggested some time ago, so naturally I'm pretty happy with it if it is.

To me, I think the scouting director really should be the only one you deal with. I think having all the scouts to hire is unnecessary. Just give the scouting director money and let him hire the scouts, and you never even really have to know their names.

To me, hiring individual scouts was the equivalent of setting the price of hot dogs or, maybe more directly, hiring a media relations manager or something. In real life, a team has many, many scouts all over the place. Replicating that would be a waste of game resources. I think you get diminishing returns as you get more detailed, and this is one area that needed to be trimmed back a bit. I can understand why others might disagree, but I've found the current scouting system to be completely unusable.

I agree with everything in this post.

[PSUColonel]

what happens if players move up and down between the majors and minors during the season? How does this effect scouting?, or is everything just simply automatic across the board?

[Zitofan75]

Originally Posted by ctorg

The new scouting system looks very close to one I suggested some time ago, so naturally I'm pretty happy with it if it is.

To me, I think the scouting director really should be the only one you deal with. I think having all the scouts to hire is unnecessary. Just give the scouting director money and let him hire the scouts, and you never even really have to know their names.

To me, hiring individual scouts was the equivalent of setting the price of hot dogs or, maybe more directly, hiring a media relations manager or something. In real life, a team has many, many scouts all over the place. Replicating that would be a waste of game resources. I think you get diminishing returns as you get more detailed, and this is one area that needed to be trimmed back a bit. I can understand why others might disagree, but I've found the current scouting system to be completely unusable.

I couldn't have said it better. One of my high school PE teachers did scouting for the Cubs (I grew up nowhere near Chicago or Illinois). Would he have been one of the 5-6 scouts in OOTP? Of course not. He was one guy out of many out there. I really like the idea shown in the screen shot.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

That's exactly what I coded yesterday

What a bright fellow you are!