Problems with minors!

mottyl · 10-02-2002, 10:19 PM

No, its not what you think.

I was wondering if the next patch would be correcting the problem with computer managed teams releasing so many players at AAA (especially) that injuries have to be filled far too often with A-ball players. I think this is only a problem with financials off, since no free-agents are ever signed (this is a big problem in its own right, since I wind up with a huge list of free agents, some of which are rated pretty highly but never get re-signed).

In a recent fictional league I came across a team that released so many catchers that it had only 1 in the entire system. If he had happened to be injured after the trading deadline (he wasn't), then the rest of the season the team would've had to use someone out of position, not too good considering they were tied for first at the time I happened to notice. This league was in its 22nd season at the time.

Perhaps I am the only one experiencing this problem.

Steve Kuffrey · 10-02-2002, 10:24 PM

The computer is handling the minors in a better manner now and the releasing of players is making the minors more realistic. The majority if not all of the players who are being let go are "dead wood". This aspect of things will not change with the 4.2 update.

Killebrew · 10-03-2002, 02:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mottyl
I was wondering if the next patch would be correcting the problem with computer managed teams releasing so many players at AAA (especially) that injuries have to be filled far too often with A-ball players.

If the AI is releasing all your AAA players that is indeed a problem, I don't think that is what is happening though. It should only be releasing players that would a) Not get minor league playing time anyway and b) prompt player development hits in your other minor league starters. Releasing the deadwood is a good thing - it should give the AI teams a much better chance of competing with the human solo player. If an AI teams minor league system is so stacked that good prospects are being released then that team has too many players in their minor league system for the AI to properly control. Reducing the draft round to around 3-7 would help this as well as solo house rules where you are not allowed to trade the AI team 5 AVG prospects for one of their stud prospects.

mottyl · 10-03-2002, 11:14 PM

A few points about this and then I'll shut up about it. I can go back to the pre-4.1 version.

1. It is very definitely not merely releasing dead wood. In my free agent list right now I can find literally dozens of pitchers under the age of 34 who have ERA and avg ratings of at least 3. They aren't all stars, obviously but they can still pitch at the AAA level. Would you release a 28 yo reliever with 9-9 ratings in the above 2 categories? Is it realistic that no other team would sign him? It hardly gives the computer-managed teams a better chance if only I could sign this guy. And a house rule saying I could never sign a released player shouldn't be necessary.

2. I'm not controlling any teams myself, so there's no seriously unbalanced trades going on.

3. I agree that releasing veteran no-hopers is a good thing, and I'm glad that there's no more teams with 40 A-ball players, but shouldn't the AI try to keep adequate subs at AAA or AA to replace injured major-leaguers? Maybe the mass releases should be occurring at the end of the season, not the beginning.

4. Most teams in my current league end the season with <5 position players at AAA and AA (they usually start the season with around 8 or 9). The released players can't have been holding up a prospect's promotion, or these rosters would not be so small since the released players would be replaced by promoted ones. If the point is to make room for prospects moving up, then why not wait until there's actually someone ready to be promoted before releasing an older player? Or keep the veteran around as a back-up?

5. I still don't see why signing released players (or off-season trading, for that matter) is verboten with financials off.

Thanks.

Steve Kuffrey · 10-03-2002, 11:25 PM

5. Is something that needs to be addressed and will.

The other issues I am not seeing nor do I recall them being seen during testing.

Killebrew · 10-04-2002, 03:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mottyl
4. Most teams in my current league end the season with <5 position players at AAA and AA (they usually start the season with around 8 or 9). The released players can't have been holding up a prospect's promotion, or these rosters would not be so small since the released players would be replaced by promoted ones. If the point is to make room for prospects moving up, then why not wait until there's actually someone ready to be promoted before releasing an older player? Or keep the veteran around as a back-up?

I agree completely, very good points raised here & I appreciate the detail in these examples. Some users want to have full 25 -50 man rosters at each level of the minors but that is obviously not your situation. Hopefully the routine for when to trigger minor league releases can be tweaked in future versions of the game.

mottyl · 10-04-2002, 01:28 PM

I don't really need to see even 25 players in the minors, unless in some future release there's full management of minors (ie. real scores and standings, where I might have to balance winning games against developing players). All I'd be looking for is enough AAA players that all positions are filled at least once, or close to it. There just needs to be some tweaking done to release players less aggressively, and maybe giving more weight to how many players at each position are actually still in the system. Or allow signing of free-agents, whichever.

I'd be willing to help test any changes to this in the future. Thanks for reading.

MJohnson · 10-04-2002, 01:39 PM

real scores and standings will be in OOTP 5

see this thread
http://www.400softwarestudios.com/bo...threadid=14612

sixto · 10-04-2002, 02:32 PM

i'm glad this thread is here because i too am frustrated with the problems of AAA and AA and free agents with financials off.

running a start-up fictional league, i've got teams with barely any AAA-level players to begin with. i seed the FA pool with players at random, and they sit. a player got created who was a RF with 8 batting ratings. never signed. a team lost one of its 2 catchers for the year, and the 2nd was an A-level player. refused to sign any catchers. in fact no FA has EVER been signed in 5 years of play.

so, ya, please, it would be great if this would be addressed. also, incidentally, and i've said this before, why even bother generating true no-hopers, players with 0 batting and 0 most everything? a player can be capable of hitting .240-.260 in the major leagues and still, with poor plate discipline and no power, be quite hopeless. please, for OOTP5, let's have more of those and fewer josh bootys.

6

10-02-2002, 10:19 PM	#1 (permalink)
mottyl Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Toronto Posts: 24 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0x in 0 posts	Problems with minors! No, its not what you think. I was wondering if the next patch would be correcting the problem with computer managed teams releasing so many players at AAA (especially) that injuries have to be filled far too often with A-ball players. I think this is only a problem with financials off, since no free-agents are ever signed (this is a big problem in its own right, since I wind up with a huge list of free agents, some of which are rated pretty highly but never get re-signed). In a recent fictional league I came across a team that released so many catchers that it had only 1 in the entire system. If he had happened to be injured after the trading deadline (he wasn't), then the rest of the season the team would've had to use someone out of position, not too good considering they were tied for first at the time I happened to notice. This league was in its 22nd season at the time. Perhaps I am the only one experiencing this problem.

10-02-2002, 10:24 PM	#2 (permalink)
Steve Kuffrey Administrator Join Date: Jul 1999 Location: S.E. TN - Georgia born and raised Posts: 16,933 Thanks: 14 Thanked 4x in 3 posts	The computer is handling the minors in a better manner now and the releasing of players is making the minors more realistic. The majority if not all of the players who are being let go are "dead wood". This aspect of things will not change with the 4.2 update. __________________ Steve Kuffrey DABS Atlanta Braves - 2008 Eastern Division Champ DBLC Atlanta Braves - 2011, 2014 East Division Champ, 2012, 2013 NL Wildcard Baseball Maelstrom-Montreal Expos-2013 Tourney winner, 2014 WC Team Sparky's League - Tampa Bay D'Rays No longer an active league.

10-03-2002, 11:25 PM	#5 (permalink)
Steve Kuffrey Administrator Join Date: Jul 1999 Location: S.E. TN - Georgia born and raised Posts: 16,933 Thanks: 14 Thanked 4x in 3 posts	5. Is something that needs to be addressed and will. The other issues I am not seeing nor do I recall them being seen during testing. __________________ Steve Kuffrey DABS Atlanta Braves - 2008 Eastern Division Champ DBLC Atlanta Braves - 2011, 2014 East Division Champ, 2012, 2013 NL Wildcard Baseball Maelstrom-Montreal Expos-2013 Tourney winner, 2014 WC Team Sparky's League - Tampa Bay D'Rays No longer an active league.

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10-03-2002, 11:14 PM	#4 (permalink)
mottyl Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Toronto Posts: 24 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0x in 0 posts	A few points about this and then I'll shut up about it. I can go back to the pre-4.1 version. 1. It is very definitely not merely releasing dead wood. In my free agent list right now I can find literally dozens of pitchers under the age of 34 who have ERA and avg ratings of at least 3. They aren't all stars, obviously but they can still pitch at the AAA level. Would you release a 28 yo reliever with 9-9 ratings in the above 2 categories? Is it realistic that no other team would sign him? It hardly gives the computer-managed teams a better chance if only I could sign this guy. And a house rule saying I could never sign a released player shouldn't be necessary. 2. I'm not controlling any teams myself, so there's no seriously unbalanced trades going on. 3. I agree that releasing veteran no-hopers is a good thing, and I'm glad that there's no more teams with 40 A-ball players, but shouldn't the AI try to keep adequate subs at AAA or AA to replace injured major-leaguers? Maybe the mass releases should be occurring at the end of the season, not the beginning. 4. Most teams in my current league end the season with <5 position players at AAA and AA (they usually start the season with around 8 or 9). The released players can't have been holding up a prospect's promotion, or these rosters would not be so small since the released players would be replaced by promoted ones. If the point is to make room for prospects moving up, then why not wait until there's actually someone ready to be promoted before releasing an older player? Or keep the veteran around as a back-up? 5. I still don't see why signing released players (or off-season trading, for that matter) is verboten with financials off. Thanks.

10-04-2002, 01:28 PM	#7 (permalink)
mottyl Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Toronto Posts: 24 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0x in 0 posts	I don't really need to see even 25 players in the minors, unless in some future release there's full management of minors (ie. real scores and standings, where I might have to balance winning games against developing players). All I'd be looking for is enough AAA players that all positions are filled at least once, or close to it. There just needs to be some tweaking done to release players less aggressively, and maybe giving more weight to how many players at each position are actually still in the system. Or allow signing of free-agents, whichever. I'd be willing to help test any changes to this in the future. Thanks for reading.

10-04-2002, 01:39 PM	#8 (permalink)
MJohnson Major Leagues Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: under an overpass Posts: 459 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0x in 0 posts	real scores and standings will be in OOTP 5 see this thread http://www.400softwarestudios.com/bo...threadid=14612

10-04-2002, 02:32 PM	#9 (permalink)
sixto Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 2,251 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1x in 1 post	i'm glad this thread is here because i too am frustrated with the problems of AAA and AA and free agents with financials off. running a start-up fictional league, i've got teams with barely any AAA-level players to begin with. i seed the FA pool with players at random, and they sit. a player got created who was a RF with 8 batting ratings. never signed. a team lost one of its 2 catchers for the year, and the 2nd was an A-level player. refused to sign any catchers. in fact no FA has EVER been signed in 5 years of play. so, ya, please, it would be great if this would be addressed. also, incidentally, and i've said this before, why even bother generating true no-hopers, players with 0 batting and 0 most everything? a player can be capable of hitting .240-.260 in the major leagues and still, with poor plate discipline and no power, be quite hopeless. please, for OOTP5, let's have more of those and fewer josh bootys. 6