Service Time Counted Wrong

[kq76]

I noticed a day of service time is being counted only every game the team plays and the player was on the major league active roster (v6.02a). As per the CBA Article XXI a day of service time is to be counted everyday between the day of the first regular season game and the last regular season game to a max of 172 (or however long you have a service year set to) that a player is on the major league active list. This can be counted by subtracting the start day from the current day (both are listed in the exporter) and adding 1. This also means pro service days can easily be counted.

page 88:
http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/.../mlbpa_cba.pdf

EDIT: corrected the error that gmo pointed out

EDIT: it appears it is only a conversion problem, but there are other problems (see my 3rd post)

[gmo]

Originally posted by kq76
I noticed a day of service time is being counted only every game the player plays (v6.02a).

Could you clarify this? I thought the game was getting this right. At very least I know my SP are not getting 32-33 service days a year.

[kq76]

Originally posted by gmo
Could you clarify this? I thought the game was getting this right. At very least I know my SP are not getting 32-33 service days a year.

Ah, yes, sorry. I meant "team plays", not "player plays". My team has so far played 114 games, but it is the 142 day of the regular season schedule (current day is 238, start day was 97, 238-97+1=142). Most of my players have 114 service days this year except for those brought up part way through and those who played in the ASG who have 115 days.

[gmo]

Originally posted by kq76
I meant "team plays", not "player plays".

Right. Should have been able to figure that out. That I thought it was working right shows that I don't know a lot of the details so well. Yet it seems like, again from what I've seen so far, somehow it can still get full years of 172 days despite not having that many games in a season while working as you describe.

As you can tell I've not paid ultra-close attention to this though.

[Ragnar]

Speaking of years in the league. I have a few guys listed with 24-26 years in the majors. Problem is they are only in their mid 30's. They would have had to have been playing at around 10-12 years old.

[holyroller]

Eureka!

Awesome stuff kq! That would explain why players with five seasons of service time are being listed as arbitration eligible on the Player Salary report when they are, in fact, free agent eligible and become so at the end of the season. The game is looking at two different service times.

[kq76]

Ahh, I just realized what was wrong. I converted this league part way through the season (I'm just testing for updating my archive utility) and the service days were screwed up in the conversion. I just simmed a week and all the players had 7 days added when under the above they should have only had 6 days added as only 6 games were played. Sorry everyone. It's still a problem, but only a conversion one. However...

Originally posted by holyroller
Eureka!

Awesome stuff kq! That would explain why players with five seasons of service time are being listed as arbitration eligible on the Player Salary report when they are, in fact, free agent eligible and become so at the end of the season. The game is looking at two different service times.

That's what I'm looking at right now. I'm not sure how the game calculates whether a player is FA eligible or arbitration eligible or arbitration possible, but either it is wrong or I am. For example:

service days left in the season = 34

Nizam Sibadili:
-majors time total = 2 yrs, 41 days
-majors time this year = 114 days
-possibly arb el in game? yes. should he be? no. 41+34=75 which is far less than the 172 required to make 3 years

EDIT: My guess right now is it is only looking at years in the majors. 2 = possible arb, 3-5 = arb eligible.

I'm going to see if it is similar for FA eligibles.

EDIT2: Well I tried my best to try to find a player with 5 yrs (and x days) of majors time that should become a FA at the end of the season (x days + 34 days remaining > 172), but I could not. The highest x I could find was 50, which I assume is just a conversion issue. I would bet that even if a player had 5 years and 171 days with plenty of days to go in the season that he would still be listed as arb eligible though. Maybe someone else can check that out.

Auto resigns should be easy too. If there is no way they could become arb eligible, even if they have 2 years, then I think they should be auto resigns. But I think the game only lists players with 0 and 1 years of majors time as auto resigns. I don't think OOTP uses that top 17% of year 2s MLB rule.

Or am I wrong about this whole, "if x + y > z then tack on another likely year"?

[sporr]

I have suggested in beta that we get more accurate reporting on contract status. Hopefully, this would alleviate the current confusion with exactly which players are arby eligible and which will be FA.

[holyroller]

Well damn. We know that somewhere, something involved with service time is fouled up. Where and what is another question. I know sporr was on to this issue a while back. Perhaps he has additional information on the subject.

[holyroller]

LOL

Speak of the devil eh. The same exact minute I mention his name in a post, he posts. Even beats me to the punch

[sporr]

Originally posted by holyroller
Well damn. We know that somewhere, something involved with service time is fouled up. Where and what is another question. I know sporr was on to this issue a while back. Perhaps he has additional information on the subject.

All I can say is that Markus did make some adjustments so that service time was handled more accurately. As for exactly what those adjustments were, I can't say. See my post above for a suggestion I made regarding the process.

[holyroller]

Well, he may have made some, but the free agency thing is still kicking around. I asume he has been made aware of this?

[sporr]

Originally posted by holyroller
Well, he may have made some, but the free agency thing is still kicking around. I asume he has been made aware of this?

Yep

[jbmagic]

there a bug in the player salary report....

read this...Henry has reported it...

why this player a free agent?

[Ktulu]

Question, is service time counted during the post season, both in the game and in MLB?

[sporr]

Originally posted by Ktulu
Question, is service time counted during the post season, both in the game and in MLB?

IRL:

(1) One full day of Major League service will be credited for
each day of the championship season a Player is on a Major League Club’s Active List. A total of 172 days of Major League credited service will constitute one full year of credited service. A Player may not be credited with more than one year of credited service, 172 days, in one championship season. Major League service will be computed commencing with the date of the first regularly scheduled championship season game, through and including the date of the last regularly scheduled championship season game. This rule shall apply uniformly to all Players and all Clubs notwithstanding differences in a particular Club’s schedule.

I guess the question is, are the playoff games considered "championship season" games. My gut instinct is that they are not. I'm not sure how the game handles this.

[Ktulu]

Thanks Sporr, I'll try and pay attention to what happens in my next post season, which should be coming up shortly.

[kq76]

Well I reconverted the lg from the beginning of the season and then simmed 67 days (109 left in the season). Here is a player that I believe will likely be a FA at the end of the year, but is listed as arb eli.

Muriu Zubayda:
-majors time total = 5 yrs, 95 days
-majors time this year = 67 days
-arb el in game? yes. should he be? no. 95+109=204 which is more than the 172 required to make 6 years. if there is a possible arb eli, then maybe there should be a possible FA for players like this one where if he plays enough of the rest of the year he will be an FA, but if he does not then he'll remain arb eli.

Originally posted by Ktulu
Question, is service time counted during the post season, both in the game and in MLB?

MLB = no

game = I don't know, but I hope not. I'll check it out...

EDIT: Well I'm finding conflicting info on the web with regard to service time during the playoffs, but I take sporr's quote of "regularly scheduled" as meaning regular season only. Maybe LGO knows?

EDIT2: the game does not count service time during the playoffs. I had a player with 13 years 11 days total and 165 days (172 is my max per year) this year who went to the playoffs and he did not gain anymore service days. I'm pretty sure MLB is no too, so this seems right.

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally posted by sporr
I guess the question is, are the playoff games considered "championship season" games.

I don't believe so. The portions of the CBA dedicated to scheduling mention that a championship season will be between 178-183 days long, and that refers to the regular season only. I think it's a phrase holdover from the very early days when there was only the NL and the team finishing first was the champion.

[gmo]

An issue I see is there has to be some decision how the reports say whether a player is a potential free agent, possibly arbitration eligible, etc. A player can have 5 years, 170 days of ML service on the first day of the season and you can say that there is no way he should be listed as arbitration eligible this offseason because he's going to have 6 years, 170 days by the end of the season. But what if something happens that first day and say he goes on the DL out for the season and gets no more time? Unlikely, but there does seem to be sense in doing what the game is in reporting, which seems to be just looking at things right at that moment. It would be reasonable to count out to the end of the season, but that would be speculation.

There does seem to be an inconsistency as the league wide news section possible FA report appears to list anybody with 5+ years even if there is no way they could get to 6 years by season's end. Seems like it is using the same logic as the game used to before service was broken down into days. Other than that though, like I said I can understand the game using the logic of "if the season ended today" even though it may be confusing and misleading. That said, counting out days to season's end may be a clearer way to do it, though I still think you can have cases where that would end up misleading. Think the game should show just one way or the other? What about somehow both?