You Have our $$$, now for an Update

[kingpin1976]

[bababui]

Originally Posted by Russ

The noob with 1 post has a point. New customers keep Markus in business, or at least a more profitable one. Calling people stupid for asking for an update or just being jerks because you have a higher post count isn't doing anybody any good.

I approve of this post.

[Curtis]

I am putting this forward as a serious proposition — When Version 11 (and each version after it) is announced, include in the initial post and the newsletter advertising it that:

"OOTP Developments is a small company, and regular updates on the game's progress should not be expected. If you don't hear from the design team, that means the designers are working, and the beta testers are honoring their non-disclosure agreements. We're sorry for your inconvenience, but we can't afford the time needed to provide updates. If something happens that prevents us from meeting the nebulous deadline mentioned in the advertisement, we WILL let you know, probably by starting a thread in the forum with the title, "Deadline Slipped!!!" If we do manage to narrow down the release date, we will probably keep that information to ourselves until [three days/a week/a fortnight (select one)]prior to the actual release.

"We would appreciate it if you did not hound us between now and the projected release date. Doing so will not make the team work any faster."

[brewertoby]

Originally Posted by Sundown_League

Well, I'm just here to figure out if I want to buy the game or not. I bought it in 2006. Wanted to see if I should buy it this year. The blind defesne (with attitude) and the absence of any update or at the very least a polite "We don't really know yet. Check back in another month." and then freeze the thread as the one response would have pretty much covered it to give everyone an easy url to paste when anybody else asked.

The perceived drama, real or unreal in reality, and unlikable attitude of 90% of the people here let me know "that's cool, I'll do just fine without the game".

... and I'm a guy that actually cares enough to post. How many you think just "Go Away" ...

I am also brand new...I've asked alot of really dumb questions on this forum and have had several people very patiently help me. I think the OP basically drew first blood by his attitude. And not just in this thread either, he did it in another with just as much attitude. The point is, if he had asked in such a manner that didn't reveal angst and undue anger, the answer would have remained the same, but I'm sure he would have been dealt with ALOT differently.

I think it's great you care enough to post. I hope you stick around. You'll see the remarkable patience that I'm talking about.

[Bobbuttons]

Originally Posted by Dargone

Guuuhhh...

[Neags23]

If someone refuses to buy a game because he or she thinks someone was rude on the game's forum, that person's never going to buy a game after visiting a forum.

This is a collection of people just like real life. We're not employees of OOTP Developments, we're not here to coddle people and hold their hand. Being polite and pleasant is preferred, sure. But suggesting that a person was going to buy a product until he saw how rude someone was that had nothing to do with that product is ridiculous. Someone that says such a thing really is either an idiot, or had no real intention to buy the game, anyway. Can you imagine saying, "Well, I was going to buy a Ford, but that guy over there who owns a Ford was a real jerk, so I'm gonna go buy a Toyota now!" Dumb.

As for updates and screenshots, being a former beta team member, this is easier said than done. And here's why. The game is constantly changing, constantly evolving up until it goes gold. Markus could finish a feature, say, "This is great, I'll post screenshots" in german, but then have a tester or someone on the design team say, "Hey, wait a minute, this is all broken, we should do it this way" and the feature takes on an entirely different direction. So then you have a screenshot or an update posted that doesn't even exist in the game, or doesn't exist in the way that we'd all expect it to.

Which is also why a lot of details are vague. "AI Improvements" is an incredibly vague thing to say, but what more can he say? He could break down every line of code for you, but all of that's bound to change at some point.

Finally, for date of release, estimating project completion is not an exact science. Just look at construction projects. Seems like everyone takes twice as long as the planners said it would. Look at the Big Dig in Boston for chrissakes.

I, myself, am notoriously bad at estimating timelines for my software projects. At work, I estimated that a small, incremental release for the project I'm working on would be finished in a week, and it took me two days. Other times, I think something will only take a coupla days and it takes me a week. And this is a project that's probably about 2% the size of a project like OOTP.

If you're so impatient for a game to come out that you have to demand updates on a forum, there's not enough going on in your life. Get a hobby. Go see a movie.

[fhomess]

Originally Posted by Neags23

Get a hobby.

But... but... but... this IS my hobby.

[mculberson1973]

Okay, just because I don't have 2500 posts on this forum doesn't make me a noob. I've been buying this game since OOTP 4, bought Inside the Park baseball, and I love what Markus and this company provides for us each and every year.

My post was not rude. Nor was my post asking for anything out of the ordinary. I can see from the title how it might be perceived that way, but I was just trying to get their attention. And yes, I do believe at this point they should have a better idea of when it might be released. I was not asking them to rush the game nor was I demanding that it be released. Markus and others have taken the time to post on here for other reasons, so I didn't think it was too much to ask for some kind of update. Thanks for what you did reply Battists.

If this were the only game in town, I would see why they would feel they don't need to update. But with Baseball Mogul out there already on the market (far inferior game) I would hate to see them lose customers because people want their baseball fix now.

And to all you forum snobs that don't respect anyone with less than 1000 posts, get a life. And to all of you out there that actually read a post before knocking it simply because it's coming from a "noob". Thanks.

Markus and OOTP will always get my business because they put out a great product. Thanks for doing so each and every year. As far as this forum, I'll pass. Thanks for the wonderful reception.

[Scottiedog]

Look mculberson1973 is correct to a large extent. Nothing is more irritating than paying money and waiting on a product. I can feel for him, I hate waiting too.
Please, everyone let off mculberson1973 some. He has the right to speak his mind, regardless of what anyone else thinks or feels.
I promise you mculberson1973 it will come. Usually, it comes out around this time of the year. I can say with 100% certainty:
1. Marcus and company will release a great game.
2. They will work quickly to fix any issue the game has.
3. At the end of day , you will be glad you bought the game.

I can honestly say, I have never been disappointed with any version of OOTP and I’ve been around since the early games. Marcus and his group do an awesome, kick @ss job!!!

[spleen1015]

No no no no no!

They still have our money and we still don't know what's going on!

We want an update. I paid $29.99 for updates!

Edit - Damn this forum for not letting me post in all CAPS!

[Neags23]

Originally Posted by fhomess

But... but... but... this IS my hobby.

Then get a second hobby!

[Syt]

Sometime lurker and first time poster.

I can understand the original poster, but on the other hand I've been in too many betas and seen too many premature releases (usually finance dictated) to push the devs too hard. The result is often a botched game that makes people angry because it doesn't hold up to their high standards, which results in a cry for patches that are then never released fast enough to keep everyone happy (or adressing all pet issues of everyone), so it's easy to get into a viscious circle.

Besides, I'm from northern Germany myself (Itzehoe, now living in Vienna), and we people up there have a reputation for being slow but thorough.

I got a new PC last week - I didn't think to store the license for OOTP9, because I'm waiting for 10 and guess it'll be out soon, anyways. Would I like it to be out already? Considering how opening day has come and gone: yes. Would I like the devs to release it in a finished state: much more so. If they put in an extra hour of coding/testing instead of writing long blog entries (as some devs - with bigger teams - like to do, even if said entries tell you little or nothing and only aim at building hype) then so be it.

Good things come to those who wait.

[snnort]

Originally Posted by Scottiedog

I can honestly say, I have never been disappointed with any version of OOTP and I’ve been around since the early games. Marcus and his group do an awesome, kick @ss job!!!

Well, I was awefully disappointed with OOTP 2006, as it was really a beta version at release and hardly playable with half the listed features. Being a complete code rewrite from scratch I realize it was no small task.. and with OOTP 8 and 9 it's obvious that OOTP 2006 was worth it. But I have to imagine that most people were very disappointed with the playability of OOTP 2006 until six months after it's release, when it was finally usable.

I've been around since OOTP 2 and have purchased every version. This was a thriving community with OOTP 5 and 6 and 6.5. I lot of people either left in the 6-9 months after OOTP 2006 or just hung there virtual cleats up for a few years. In the recent 6 months people are coming back, people that were serious OOTPers back in 2003 and 2004. It's great to see.

But regarding the release date... it's part of getting this kind of product, from a very small company. But this is simulation quality at it's best. This is the grand daddy of simulations, it's the creme of the crop.

When you buy the best car that money can buy, you pay a lot more than you would for the average car. Five to ten times more is not unheard of. But with OOTP... you pay pretty much the same as for the run of the mill, average baseball simulation.

OOTP is a deal... and pre-ordering it is even better. There have been OOTP releases that have not come until late May and I think even early June (my memory could be bad though). ANY time I get one before May 15th... I consider that yet another bonus in a long line of serious bargains that you get with OOTP.

My

[silvam14]

I wish Markus would just refund the money to people on here complaining and let them re-purchase at full price when it comes out because apparently, the $10 savings isn't enough.

[Malleus Dei]

Originally Posted by EMSoccerCoach

Stupid people amuse me. You didn't have to pay in advance. Nobody promised you added updates in return. If you assumed that, you were dumb. Next time, don't be.

I couldn't have put it any better myself.

[silvam14]

Originally Posted by Malleus Dei

I couldn't have put it any better myself.

Gotta love this time of year eh Mal?

[Malleus Dei]

Originally Posted by silvam14

I wish Markus would just refund the money to people on here complaining and let them re-purchase at full price when it comes out because apparently, the $10 savings isn't enough.

LOL, good idea.

[satchel]

Originally Posted by mculberson1973

If it's going to be another month, just tell us.

I'm just telling you: it's going to be another month.

[wspahn21]

Originally Posted by mculberson1973

I really don't think it's too much to ask for some kind of update. You have been developing this game year in an year out, and if you don't have a better idea other than "Spring" at this point, that's just b.s.

When it's ready it will be ready is not acceptable either. I've paid for the product, and I only think it's fair to get some kind of update as to when that product will be delivered.

Simply narrowing the window of possibilities would be nice, but no answer is not good business.

Tomorrow is opening day, and I know we are all itching to play the game. If it's going to be another month, just tell us. I'm not asking for a rush on things, but as a paying customer I'm just asking for some kind of update that will give us loyal customers a better understanding of when we will be receiving the product.

Thanks in advance.

Matt

Matt,

Welcome to the forums.

As you have found out, this place is filled with more fanboys than a Steve Jobs presentation at MacWorld.

They like to complain and ask for features all the time but god forbid a new person do it. Get some posts under your belt and they will let you complain and moan all you want. I myself hardly have any posts but I have been a member longer than a lot of Hall of Famers, I am the perennial lurker.

I do hope you tough it out though, and just remember never to make a disparaging word about Markus or the product and you will be okay.

[dsvitak]

Originally Posted by Russ

The noob with 1 post has a point. New customers keep Markus in business, or at least a more profitable one. Calling people stupid for asking for an update or just being jerks because you have a higher post count isn't doing anybody any good.

The noob should not have used "b.s" in his second sentence.

The rest of us are clearly more patient.

It is the way of all forums, everywhere. Noobs should take a look at the lay of the land, and attempt to conform their behaviors to that of the board.

Yeah, I would like an update too...and frankly, customer service for a very small company is difficult, especially in the rush to finish the product, and get it out the door.