Developing a pitcher....

[Base Stealer]

I have a question for all the experts out there
If the computer generates a pitcher that has, for exemple, a stamina of 5 and 2 pitches, how can i make his stamina go up to starter level?? and.... is there a way to make him develop a 3rd pitch or is this thing random??
Moreover....are these things related to the Talent Change Randomness?? and, if so, what's the best value for this??

Thanks a lot for any reply

[risp2out]

Along the same lines - can anyone tell me if a pitcher is any more likely to develop a third pitch while in the majors or the minors? And if it's in the minors, should he be used as a starter or reliever to make it more likely?

Thanks.

[GBS]

These are good questions. Hope someone in the know responds.

[Kelric]

I have heard, but not yet seen, that a pitcher is more likely to develop a new pitch as a starter. And in following other OOTP versions, the best way to try and build his endurance is as a starter.

[Base Stealer]

Thanks for the infos....
Someone has more infos on this and on talent change randomness?? Does this affect only the overall values or also the pitches a pitcher has??

[neojonas]

A pitcher tends to learn pitchers when he is younger, but it can happen anytime.

[t-bone shuffle]

The idea, and it was tested pretty thoroughly in beta, and for the most part considered successful is that it should resemble reality.

That is to say for example, if you've got a 20 year old, with acceptable stamina and two pretty good pitches, you should do what would be done IRL. Put him in low minors as a starter and watch his development. If he remains healthy and pitches regularly, he should develop at least another pitch. The quality of this pitch of course, will likely be minimal initially. Further development will depend upon a variance of things, just like IRL, and over the next couple of years, this guy will either continue to develop as a starter (pitches wise), or he'll find himself at age 24, still having only two pitches he throws well enough to pitch to big-league talent. At that point, it's on you to decide, can this guy contribute at the ml level in the bullpen, or do I want to continue to see if he can make it as a starter, etc, etc.

There are guys from the beta team that lived and breathed this pitching change who could probably do much better than the above (and maybe one of them will chip in), but I feel fairly certain in saying that the idea is to have it mirror reality. My time testing it told me that it does a pretty respectable job. A big leap forward in my opinion.

[bschr682]

So does this explain then why my ace closer (who happens to be only the age of 22 with borderline starter stamina) has the predicted role of mlb starter? Ala Chamberlain/Papelbon dilemna? So i can in theory send this guy down to the minors, make him a starter and he in effect "stretches out" and if he is a stud will develop that 3rd or 4th pitch? If this is the case I am thoroughly impressed with this new pitching system.

[thomamon]

Originally Posted by bschr682

So does this explain then why my ace closer (who happens to be only the age of 22 with borderline starter stamina) has the predicted role of mlb starter? Ala Chamberlain/Papelbon dilemna? So i can in theory send this guy down to the minors, make him a starter and he in effect "stretches out" and if he is a stud will develop that 3rd or 4th pitch? If this is the case I am thoroughly impressed with this new pitching system.

Bingo!

[bschr682]

this brings about another question a lil bit off topic. I just had a draft and had two 1st round picks. #5 and #9. I selected two high school pitchers bother listed as MR. Both had the stamina to start and both had two projected to be excellent pitches. Neither had a 3rd pitch. Why is the suggested role for one starter and the other strictly bullpen? Does the game have some inside knowledge and "know" that the one guy has a high probability of learning that 3rd dominant pitch and the other guy is more likely to have a mediocre at best 3rd pitch?

[andymac]

Originally Posted by bschr682

Does the game have some inside knowledge and "know" that the one guy has a high probability of learning that 3rd dominant pitch and the other guy is more likely to have a mediocre at best 3rd pitch?

It is hard to say why the game picked one guy to be a starter and not the other without seeing the actual ratings, however, the computer AI does not know any more than you are whether the pitcher will learn a new pitch.

[Nutlaw]

Of note, pitcher role usage does not affect development at all. Using an inappropriate pitcher as a starter will not turn him into a properly rated starter any more often than using him as a reliever.

There is no way to coax an extra pitch out of a pitcher at present, because then everyone would be doing it all the time. Think of it this way: young pitchers are always tinkering around with new pitches, but only a few of them figure out how to make them worthwile.

[RebelFan]

After reading the first 9 posts in this thread I was starting to get exciting about the new pitching component. It looked like we could affect a pitchers development (starter v. reliever) by how we used him in his early years.

Then Nutlaw sort of threw cold water on that idea. Based on reading his earlier write-up on pitching, I assume he knows what he is talking about. By the way, you said the role in which he is used doesn't affect his development. By "development" did you mean new pitches or overall development including endurance, etc. Maybe I am reading too much into Nutlaw's comments, but it sounds like pitcher development is pretty much random, not affected by actions by us managers. If so, it's rather disappointing.

Also, the OP asked if talent change randomness settings would affect this. I wonder if any knows if a higher randomness setting would affect additional pitch development?

[bschr682]

Originally Posted by Nutlaw

Of note, pitcher role usage does not affect development at all. Using an inappropriate pitcher as a starter will not turn him into a properly rated starter any more often than using him as a reliever.

There is no way to coax an extra pitch out of a pitcher at present, because then everyone would be doing it all the time. Think of it this way: young pitchers are always tinkering around with new pitches, but only a few of them figure out how to make them worthwile.

im not really trying to coax an extra pitch out of a guy im just trying to determine which of my young guys i should test as a starter vs which of em will never make it. I was just curious if the suggested role had a role in this beyone just a mere suggestion.

[Base Stealer]

Nice info for me here. Thanks. The only thing i need to understand, for now, is about talent change randomness....that's a bit difficult for me to understand related to this new pitching system....

[Nutlaw]

Originally Posted by RebelFan

By "development" did you mean new pitches or overall development including endurance, etc. Maybe I am reading too much into Nutlaw's comments, but it sounds like pitcher development is pretty much random, not affected by actions by us managers. If so, it's rather disappointing.

Also, the OP asked if talent change randomness settings would affect this. I wonder if any knows if a higher randomness setting would affect additional pitch development?

Neither new pitch nor endurance development should be affected by role in OOTP. I agree that it would be interesting, but the game does not currently work in that way.

I have not tested whether or not a higher talent change randomness would affect the learning of a new pitch. I might guess that it would, but I honestly have no idea.

[Nutlaw]

Originally Posted by bschr682

im not really trying to coax an extra pitch out of a guy im just trying to determine which of my young guys i should test as a starter vs which of em will never make it. I was just curious if the suggested role had a role in this beyone just a mere suggestion.

The suggested role displays a pitcher's suitability for starting as he stands today. It suggests nothing about future development. It certainly does not indicate the likelihood of learning a new pitch.

Keep in mind that suggested role varies by league level and that you'll want to use the dropdown to compare major league roles to major league roles when comparing two different players.

You will presently get no benefit from demoting your closer to Triple A to gain work as a Starter. If the game tells you that he is a Starter in the majors, then he is ready to start right now. Just be aware that Borderline or Emergency Starters will not fare nearly as well as Starters.

[nyy26wc]

Originally Posted by RebelFan

Then Nutlaw sort of threw cold water on that idea.

I have to disagree. I like what Nutlaw said. Pitching "prospects" should be a complete crapshoot. I consider all minor league pitchers, both in OOTP and reality, to be future waiver wire occupants until they actually prove themselves in the majors.

[magnet]

Originally Posted by nyy26wc

i have to disagree. I like what nutlaw said. Pitching "prospects" should be a complete crapshoot. I consider all minor league pitchers, both in ootp and reality, to be future waiver wire occupants until they actually prove themselves in the majors.

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