Better players do get the nicknames

jmknpk2 · 11-12-2009, 12:00 PM

I just ran across this in the online manual. "Typically, the higher the player's potential, the more likely he is to receive a nickname."

This confirms something I have suspected for a long time, but was not able to confirm until now. I remember way back in version 5, as I was still trying to get a handle on how to evaluate a player, that I thought I noticed the good players had nicknames. So I tried to trade for prospects with nicknames. It was probably a better evaluation tool than any other I had at the time.

That reminds me of one of my earliest strategies, with version 4 I think. During the inaugural draft, after I drafted decent pitchers, I was frustrated that there were no decent hitters left. But I noticed there were plenty of hitters with high ratings in triples. So I focused almost exclusively on the triple rating, hoping to build a team of players who would triple in runs. The plan failed miserably. But it was a necessary step along the old learning curve.

I've come a long way since then.

markprior22 · 11-12-2009, 12:31 PM

That's kind of disappointing to know. I've played OOTP since v 4 and actually have never read the manual. The less I know about the inner workings of a game, the better. I've often wondered about the nickname thing but was hoping it was more random. Having said that, I can't believe that it would be so overdone as to allow someone to put together a good team based only on that...I hope not anyway.

Sweed · 11-12-2009, 12:50 PM

I'll start with I didn't know this was in the manual but is it really different than real life? Star players (eg. guys that look to have the potential to play at higher levels) tend to get nicknames eg. Flash, The Hammer, etc., a high school pitcher with a mid 90's fastball is much more likely to have a nickname than a guy that throws 83 mph, no?

The key for OOTP is that the nickname, while telling you the guy is\was a star coming up through little league, high school, and college, it does not indicate that his chances are better at developing into a MLB player.

In past OOTP versions the nickname, I believe, did indicate that a player was much more likely to become good. It was "fixed" IIRC maybe version 6 or OOTP 2006(?) and the nickname now doesn't really give you any heads-up on how the guy will develop. It is something I have watched over the years and can say that at least in my long running solo league that I see plenty of "nickname busts" and plenty of low rated "no-nickname players" that flourish.

markprior22 · 11-12-2009, 12:54 PM

Well, that's good to know then.

Bluenoser · 11-12-2009, 02:54 PM

Well, I highly doubt if you drafted only players with a nickname that you'd build a winner. Having potential and realizing it in OOTP are two completely different things. Far more players with high potential flame out than become a success.

Malleus Dei · 11-12-2009, 03:01 PM

And some plowhorses grow up to become champion thoroughbreds.

OldFatGuy · 11-12-2009, 06:34 PM

Huh, thanks for pointing this out. I suspected it almost a year ago, but as you can see, I was basically told no, that's not the case.

Still wondering about MD's post above. I'm now entering my 18th year in my OOTP8 league. And nearly ALL of my studs flame out, yet I've NEVER seen ONE reverse be true.

I really wonder if player development works correctly in a league with no minors, because I know ALL the players on the reserve roster are ALWAYS ANGRY. And I thought I read somewhere that this affected performance AND development.

Malleus Dei · 11-12-2009, 07:24 PM

I've had some late-round draft picks end up as good players.

Daern · 11-12-2009, 08:40 PM

My best player now, a 2nd baseman who hit 45 HRs two years straight, was called up four years ago as filler after an injury. He was an undrafted FA with terrible HS stats, and my scouting director basically called him trash, but after he hit .345 with 4 homers in a short call-up as a defensive replacement--he had high ratings at all infield positions--I gave him a chance on the roster the next year, and a star was born.

OldFatGuy · 11-13-2009, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malleus Dei

I've had some late-round draft picks end up as good players.

Oh, I don't doubt it. I just wonder if it's something in my setup. Like no minors with the morale system being used. I'm just wondering if that combination is bad for development. Because with no minors, the players you draft in June, start out at Happy. Then the next month they're normal. Then the next month... and they're all angry before that first season is through. And stay that way until you put 'em in the majors.

I'm just beginning to think that that must have an impact on development, and maybe that's why I'm not seeing any of the reverse, and why nearly every draft pick I pick flames out. I've only improved my team via free agency, so apparently the other teams are developing talent.

And no, it's not coaches. I've got all of the best rated coaches on my team, and have throughout. But I've gotta think something is wrong. Only conclusion I have is that maybe using reserve rosters with no minors doesn't work so well in conjuction with the morale system. Of course, this wouldn't explain why my team can't develop talent and the other teams can. That one leads to a conclusion I really don't like.

Sweed · 11-13-2009, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldFatGuy

Oh, I don't doubt it. I just wonder if it's something in my setup. Like no minors with the morale system being used. I'm just wondering if that combination is bad for development. Because with no minors, the players you draft in June, start out at Happy. Then the next month they're normal. Then the next month... and they're all angry before that first season is through. And stay that way until you put 'em in the majors.

I'm just beginning to think that that must have an impact on development, and maybe that's why I'm not seeing any of the reverse, and why nearly every draft pick I pick flames out. I've only improved my team via free agency, so apparently the other teams are developing talent.

And no, it's not coaches. I've got all of the best rated coaches on my team, and have throughout. But I've gotta think something is wrong. Only conclusion I have is that maybe using reserve rosters with no minors doesn't work so well in conjuction with the morale system. Of course, this wouldn't explain why my team can't develop talent and the other teams can. That one leads to a conclusion I really don't like.

IMHO you should set up a simple three level minor league, A, AA, AAA and let the AI run it for you. With ghost players you could still go with small drafts and even have only one or two levels of minors if you wished. At least it would give your players a place to play and develop and take care of the morale issues you are seeing. All at no real cost to you.

So what if a random player doesn't develop to his highest potential because the AI left him in A ball to long? He's already not developing in your current reserve system. What have you got to lose?

11-12-2009, 12:00 PM	#1 (permalink)
jmknpk2 All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 706 Thanks: 67 Thanked 103x in 61 posts	Better players do get the nicknames I just ran across this in the online manual. "Typically, the higher the player's potential, the more likely he is to receive a nickname." This confirms something I have suspected for a long time, but was not able to confirm until now. I remember way back in version 5, as I was still trying to get a handle on how to evaluate a player, that I thought I noticed the good players had nicknames. So I tried to trade for prospects with nicknames. It was probably a better evaluation tool than any other I had at the time. That reminds me of one of my earliest strategies, with version 4 I think. During the inaugural draft, after I drafted decent pitchers, I was frustrated that there were no decent hitters left. But I noticed there were plenty of hitters with high ratings in triples. So I focused almost exclusively on the triple rating, hoping to build a team of players who would triple in runs. The plan failed miserably. But it was a necessary step along the old learning curve. I've come a long way since then.

11-12-2009, 02:54 PM	#5 (permalink)
Bluenoser Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 5,598 Thanks: 56 Thanked 442x in 307 posts	Well, I highly doubt if you drafted only players with a nickname that you'd build a winner. Having potential and realizing it in OOTP are two completely different things. Far more players with high potential flame out than become a success. __________________ It takes neither courage nor intelligence to cheer for a team only when that team wins. The true test of a fan's mettle is the same as it is for a player: Were you there when you were needed?

11-12-2009, 06:34 PM	#7 (permalink)
OldFatGuy All Star Starter Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Northern Va., Loudoun County Posts: 1,391 Thanks: 22 Thanked 80x in 52 posts	Huh, thanks for pointing this out. I suspected it almost a year ago, but as you can see, I was basically told no, that's not the case. Still wondering about MD's post above. I'm now entering my 18th year in my OOTP8 league. And nearly ALL of my studs flame out, yet I've NEVER seen ONE reverse be true. I really wonder if player development works correctly in a league with no minors, because I know ALL the players on the reserve roster are ALWAYS ANGRY. And I thought I read somewhere that this affected performance AND development. __________________ How can you wheel that lumber tomorrow if you don't pound that Budweiser tonight? - Frank Howard

11-12-2009, 08:40 PM	#9 (permalink)
Daern Minors (Double A) Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 148 Thanks: 1 Thanked 21x in 12 posts	My best player now, a 2nd baseman who hit 45 HRs two years straight, was called up four years ago as filler after an injury. He was an undrafted FA with terrible HS stats, and my scouting director basically called him trash, but after he hit .345 with 4 homers in a short call-up as a defensive replacement--he had high ratings at all infield positions--I gave him a chance on the roster the next year, and a star was born. __________________ UNDERGROUND BASEBALL LEAGUE: (Havana Rovers) 2009: 99-63 (Pennant Winners) 2010: 87-75 (Division Winners) 2011: 92-70 (Division Winners) 2012: 104-58 (Pennant Winners) 2013: 69-93 (4th Place) 2014: 108-54 (Pennant Winners) 2015: 115-47 (Pennant Winners) 2016: 95-67 (Pennant Winners) 2017: 94-68 (CHAMPIONS) 2018: 104-58 (Pennant Winners) 2019: 119-43 (Pennant Winners) 2020: 121-41 (CHAMPIONS) 2021: 86-76 (Wild Card) 2022: Who knows?

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11-12-2009, 12:31 PM	#2 (permalink)
markprior22 All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: springfield, illinois Posts: 952 Thanks: 69 Thanked 106x in 24 posts	That's kind of disappointing to know. I've played OOTP since v 4 and actually have never read the manual. The less I know about the inner workings of a game, the better. I've often wondered about the nickname thing but was hoping it was more random. Having said that, I can't believe that it would be so overdone as to allow someone to put together a good team based only on that...I hope not anyway.

11-12-2009, 12:50 PM	#3 (permalink)
Sweed Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Iowa Posts: 2,439 Thanks: 324 Thanked 289x in 134 posts	I'll start with I didn't know this was in the manual but is it really different than real life? Star players (eg. guys that look to have the potential to play at higher levels) tend to get nicknames eg. Flash, The Hammer, etc., a high school pitcher with a mid 90's fastball is much more likely to have a nickname than a guy that throws 83 mph, no? The key for OOTP is that the nickname, while telling you the guy is\was a star coming up through little league, high school, and college, it does not indicate that his chances are better at developing into a MLB player. In past OOTP versions the nickname, I believe, did indicate that a player was much more likely to become good. It was "fixed" IIRC maybe version 6 or OOTP 2006(?) and the nickname now doesn't really give you any heads-up on how the guy will develop. It is something I have watched over the years and can say that at least in my long running solo league that I see plenty of "nickname busts" and plenty of low rated "no-nickname players" that flourish.

11-12-2009, 12:54 PM	#4 (permalink)
markprior22 All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: springfield, illinois Posts: 952 Thanks: 69 Thanked 106x in 24 posts	Well, that's good to know then.