A Fresh Idea for the GM Experieince

[Honorable_Pawn]

For one, the finances in the game are pretty lame. Merchandising revenue and concession sales are tied directly to attendance. I haven't done the math on this version yet but in the past it was a flat percentage of the ticket price times the attendance.

This could easily be improved by tying merchandising sales to attendance as it currently is with a baseline flat percentage. But there should be a modifier to this product. One idea would be to modify the product mentioned above by a factor that would be determined by the avg of the total numerical popularity of the two teams combined. There are other additional modifiers that could be interesting if they were implemented such as tying this modifier to player performance.

Concessions are also a flat percentage of ticket price times attendance. This number should also be modified. Weekend games will sell a higher percentage of concessions than weekday games, etc etc.

I would like to see more financial information in the game like a GM would face in IRL. Salaries (administrative) city leases, security, traffic control expenses, supplies, et al.

I want a real income statement and a real balance sheet. I want sliders that I can use to hire the employees. For example there could be a page that was called administrative.

On this page would be several sliders such as the following:

Concession/ushers/janitorial/etc
This slider could be set at $7.00/hr through $20/hr. The higher the slider is set the more my salary expense for this group of employees would be. But there should be a benefit--more concession sales maybe, slightly better fan interest, something. The opposite would be true if the slider were reduced.

Maintenance workers etc
This could be set from an average annual salary of $10K-100K/yr. Moving this slider higher results in higher maintenance salary expense but will offset R&M expense and how often complete interior renovations are done i.e. painting walls, chairs, etc etc. The opposite would be true if the slider were reduced.

Groundskeepers
A slider with annual salaries the higher the better the field conditions. Increases affect salaries but the benefits would be slightly better player morale, fewer injuries, better fan interest etc.

Office personnel
Moving this slider higher would increase attract better accountants, controllers, CFO's etc. This would result in higher margins, increased revenue per ticket sold, etc.

Marketing/Public relations
Higher slider movement would result in more attendance better relations with community, cheaper police/traffic control expense, cheaper annual leases on the property.

You get the idea. More sliders, more decisions, more immersion.

It also should all be balanced so that you couldn't just raise everything to the max. Maybe the owner sets budgets for these expenses that are not player salaries.

These are some of the things that I wish were in the game. I understand that a lot of people play out every game (I play out a lot of games too) and just want to be managers that make player transaction decisions. But, nevertheless, I would like to see more of these kinds of decisions.

I want a bigger picture...a much more advanced macro level of the finances but with more micro-level decisions.

What are your thoughts?

BTW, let me kill the it would have to be optional argument. Lets assume that it is. There could be a contract labor option that handles this. It could be done at an average level of efficiency. Of course a skilled GM could do a better job if he/she controlled these microlevel decisions. (i.e. not using automatic city governor in CIV IV, not automating your workers)


EDIT: I don't want this to turn into I don't like that idea, well I do flame war. I just want to discuss these ideas with people that are like me so that we can have our little dream. We know it's not going to happen but that doesn't mean we cant flesh out our ideas.

[olivertheorem]

I can understand wanting this, but I think the majority of OOTP players would ignore such options (probably considering it unnecessary micromanagement). While this does not automatically make the notion untenable, it must be noted that Markus has to balance the amount of work/money it would take to implement an idea against the potential gain.

I just don't think the overall potential is there to have the OP's idea generate sufficient increased revenue to offset the costs in time/money to implement them in a workable way.

[dickysty]

I don't mind the ideas, but to me it sounds too much like a job. I want to play ball not look at balance sheets all night. But, to each his own! Not knocking it , just not my cup of tea.


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[Orcin]

Originally Posted by Honorable_Pawn

I want a bigger picture...a much more advanced macro level of the finances but with more micro-level decisions.

What are our thoughts?

I like baseball myself.

[JTSMOOTH]

It's not something that would interest me personally, i really only care about the baseball side of the operations. I don't imagine spending any time on how much my grounds crew or concession workers are making...But that is just me.

[ohms_law]

I'd love for these games to be more of a business sim than they are (you are supposed to be the General Manager, after all...), but as you can see from the reactions above we're apparently in the minority.

Such is life.

[Honorable_Pawn]

Originally Posted by olivertheorem

I can understand wanting this, but I think the majority of OOTP players would ignore such options (probably considering it unnecessary micromanagement). While this does not automatically make the notion untenable, it must be noted that Markus has to balance the amount of work/money it would take to implement an idea against the potential gain.

I just don't think the overall potential is there to have the OP's idea generate sufficient increased revenue to offset the costs in time/money to implement them in a workable way.

You make a good point. Firaxis completely dumbed down CIV 5 so that they would sell more units to the casual fan. IMO they completely regressed on all the progress that the series had made over the last decade or so.

Back to the topic. I was under the impression that we were a niche market that Marcus was catering to. Moreover, I assumed that most of us were micro-management personality types. For me, the reason that I haven't purchased a version of OOTP since 2008 (I have 13) is because I thought the game was pretty thin. There just wasn't enough to do. Don't get me wrong I think this is a very good title but there just isn't enough to do.

Thinking like I was I thought that there might be a lot of people out there like me. People who want more immersion in the GM experience.

Anyway, thanks for taking the time to respond.

[Honorable_Pawn]

Originally Posted by dickysty

I don't mind the ideas, but to me it sounds too much like a job. I want to play ball not look at balance sheets all night. But, to each his own! Not knocking it , just not my cup of tea.


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I love spreadsheets and decisions. Especially decisions that are meaningful and difficult to balance. I enjoy solving puzzles. Add that to baseball and I would be in heaven.

[Honorable_Pawn]

Originally Posted by Orcin

I like baseball myself.

Me too. You have a great dynasty report. I enjoy it.

[D-BacksJosh]

Originally Posted by dickysty

I don't mind the ideas, but to me it sounds too much like a job. I want to play ball not look at balance sheets all night. But, to each his own! Not knocking it , just not my cup of tea. .

^^^This

[Honorable_Pawn]

Originally Posted by ohms_law

I'd love for these games to be more of a business sim than they are (you are supposed to be the General Manager, after all...), but as you can see from the reactions above we're apparently in the minority.

Such is life.

I'm not sold that this is the case just yet. The type of people that like railroad tycoon, Paradox Interactive games, CIV IV, Sim City 4, and other similar titles would thoroughly enjoy an OOTP Tycoon type game.

[ohms_law]

Originally Posted by dickysty

I don't mind the ideas, but to me it sounds too much like a job. I want to play ball not look at balance sheets all night. But, to each his own! Not knocking it , just not my cup of tea.


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The thing is, they ("they" being Markus and Andreus, obviously) should make it so that the roles are more well defined. "look[ing] at balance sheets all night" is the GM's job. Playing baseball is the manager's job. That's why they wear uniforms, you know.

[Honorable_Pawn]

Originally Posted by ohms_law

The thing is, they ("they" being Markus and Andreus, obviously) should make it so that the roles are more well defined. "look[ing] at balance sheets all night" is the GM's job. Playing baseball is the manager's job. That's why they wear uniforms, you know.

Well said, I couldn't agree more.

[Marinersfan51]

I like the idea, but I know that I would not actually enjoy playing that way and would ignore/automate it fairly quickly

[ohms_law]

Originally Posted by Honorable_Pawn

I'm not sold that this is the case just yet. The type of people that like railroad tycoon, Paradox Interactive games, CIV IV, Sim City 4, and other similar titles would thoroughly enjoy an OOTP Tycoon type game.

You'd think, wouldn't you? What you're describing here is the way that I would describe myself (and yourself, I assume). However, you'll notice that the first half-dozen or so replies were negative to varying degrees, so... *shrug*

[The Game]

I am the General Manager, not the owner. No offense but I hate your ideas. 1 thing is that in say a market such as NYC, concessions will make more $$ then in say Pittsburgh. COL is so much higher in NYC then Pittsburgh. So naturally the concessions guy will make say $15.00 an hr while the concessions guy in Pittsburgh makes $7.00.
Teams aren't going broke because of how much they pay "the help".

[Honorable_Pawn]

Originally Posted by ohms_law

You'd think, wouldn't you? What you're describing here is the way that I would describe myself (and yourself, I assume). However, you'll notice that the first half-dozen or so replies were negative to varying degrees, so... *shrug*

I think this game got its foot in the door with the older stratomatic generation that used to simulate seasons with baseball cards and dice. I do think, however, that over time this game has attracted another crowd. A younger nerd. A nerd that was raised with more technology and more simulation type titles available. This mix is very interesting and I have defined it in two extremes (naturally, there are variations along the spectrum).

With that being said, I think there is a slight tug of war between the two camps. As time progresses Marcus will need to keep evolving the product in order to keep it fresh. New concepts and ideas will be necessary to attract a newer tech savy generation.

[endgame]

Originally Posted by ohms_law

You'd think, wouldn't you? What you're describing here is the way that I would describe myself (and yourself, I assume). However, you'll notice that the first half-dozen or so replies were negative to varying degrees, so... *shrug*

I don't think the issue is one that needs to become divisive. It's just opinion, regardless if it advocates the OPs idea or expresses opposition to it. Like he said, it'd likely be optional, if it were implemented.

Graphics and the "hot dogs and buns" suggestions do seem to trigger some emotional reactions, for whatever reasons, but they don't have to. Any ideas, well thought out, presented and explained, make good topics for conversation and consideration. In many cases, regardless how far-reaching the feature may seem, and it proves enough merit and interest, at the very least, some small increment of it may be included in a future version to 'get the ball started.' Ball animations are one example, and it's still around. Marriage and family is another, but it didn't last.

So particularly for those who fall on the advocate's side of this or any other issue, present it, expand on it, talk about it, and avoid paying too much attention to opposition. A seemingly 'unpopular' thread should be able to exist and its subject be explored without letting it disintegrate into dissention and argument. To those who oppose it, say it, but don't dwell. In the final analysis, if an area can evolve that assuredly builds a possibility to increase sales, then it's worth the conversation and risk on the front end.

[Honorable_Pawn]

Originally Posted by The Game

I am the General Manager, not the owner. No offense but I hate your ideas. 1 thing is that in say a market such as NYC, concessions will make more $$ then in say Pittsburgh. COL is so much higher in NYC then Pittsburgh. So naturally the concessions guy will make say $15.00 an hr while the concessions guy in Pittsburgh makes $7.00.
Teams aren't going broke because of how much they pay "the help".

I'm not going to try and win you over but the baseball operations and the financial operations would simply consolidate. Obviously, day-to-day operations are not going to bankrupt a team but those people do play an important part of the culture of an organization. And the more efficient they are the larger the margins will be.

As a matter of a fact, you have sparked another idea for me. Another slider could be the hiring of the play-by-play guys. Obviously the better the play-by-play guy you have the better your fan interest would be. Excellent. Thank you for that inspiratation!

[Honorable_Pawn]

EDIT: I don't want this to turn into I don't like that idea, well I do flame war. I just want to discuss these ideas with people that are like me so that we can have our little dream. We know it's not going to happen but that doesn't mean we cant flesh out our ideas.