Batter vs. pitcher statistics - do they mean anything in the game?

Puckett guy · 02-26-2007, 05:15 PM

My apologies if this has been previously discussed. My search of the threads did not help.

OOTP tracks and provides detailed information about specific batter vs. pitcher statistics. We can debate for hours whether such statistics are or should be important to managers IRL. Certainly the broadcasters and media make a big deal about it. E.g. "(batter) has a lifetime career average against (pitcher) of only .045, you have to wonder why (manager) has not elected send up a pinch hitter in this situation."

Here is my question. Other than the right and left characteristics, does OOTP in some way model that certain batters will do better (or worse) against certain pitchers? In other words, can the batter vs. pitcher stats be important for making managerial decisions, or are such stats just displaying randomnly made history?

Craig Scarborough · 02-26-2007, 05:34 PM

I seriously doubt it, unless some kind of modeling was in the program to support batter/pitcher pitch preferences (that could have probably been phrased better).

I can't imagine it's on a pitcher vs. batter basis, as the database required would be astronomical in size.

Kaitiaki · 02-26-2007, 06:24 PM

I'm pretty sure the marketing for OOTP2006 said that some batters would do better/worse against some pitchers, but I have no statistical evidence from the game to ascertain whether or not that actually happens/is working correctly or not.

- Kai

CHCfan · 02-26-2007, 08:52 PM

I thought I remember Markus saying this is the case, and people (IIRC) were quite upset about this, so who knows . . . maybe he changed it. Though, to his credit, if Markus thinks something is right for the game, he'll stick with it.

Curtis · 02-27-2007, 01:49 AM

Markus did say this was a feature, in response to an observation that (I think) Waninski made about one of his hitters 'owning' a pitcher. Waninski thought it was a good thing, others thought it bad.

Claymore · 02-27-2007, 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curtis

Markus did say this was a feature, in response to an observation that (I think) Waninski made about one of his hitters 'owning' a pitcher. Waninski thought it was a good thing, others thought it bad.

I like the concept, but would like to understand more of how it works...

Puckett guy · 02-27-2007, 02:21 AM

Based on your helpful replies I was able to find a post from Markus in which he said

Quote:

(s)ome hitters perform better against certain pitchers in OOTP, and vice-versa...

So that answers my question. The batter vs. pitcher stats may actually mean something. Cool!

Nu-Bru · 02-27-2007, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puckett guy

Based on your helpful replies I was able to find a post from Markus in which he said

Quote:

(s)ome hitters perform better against certain pitchers in OOTP, and vice-versa...

So that answers my question. The batter vs. pitcher stats may actually mean something. Cool!

I don't know . . . that may have been just a throw-away comment on how it appears to be in the game, not actually how he designed it. Read through these two threads in which I got the impression that sample size and randomness are the real causes of certain players "owning" other players.

http://ootpdevelopments.com/board/sh...d.php?t=134016

Batters Owning Certain Pitchers

Craig Scarborough · 02-27-2007, 10:18 AM

This might be a part of standard righties do better against lefties, groundball hitters do better against flyball pitchers (and vice versa), etc., but I doubt it's hard coded on a pitcher vs. batter basis.

Puckett guy · 02-27-2007, 12:11 PM

What I quoted in my last post is the only comment I have found from Markus on the subject. His comment is indeed open to interpretation, but to me it indicates that he has modeled in the game that some specific batter/pitcher matchups will affect the outcome of the at bat. I speculate that this is infrequent and that there are many other factors which the game takes into account in determining the outcome.

Anyway, I am going with that thought until I am proven wrong. It just seems to me that all the info in the game about batter v. pitcher stats is a waste of time and screen space if it is not in some way modeled into the game. However, those stats are typically based upon a very small sample and the manager has to keep that in mind in deciding whether they should be given any weight in making managerial decisions (which is all part of the fun).

Curtis · 02-27-2007, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puckett guy

Those stats are typically based upon a very small sample and the manager has to keep that in mind in deciding whether they should be given any weight in making managerial decisions (which is all part of the fun).

I ignore them, though I do look at righty/lefty, which is also usually too small a sample. That's just the kind of guy I am.

Fallschirmjager · 02-27-2007, 04:50 PM

Instead of batters being succesful against certain pitchers, some hitters are better against certain types of pitchers.
i.e. Hitters doing better against pitchers with good control who throw alot of breaking balls

Also some hitters are just plain better at hitting certain pitches.
So if a pitcher relies heavily on a certain pitch a hitter could benefit

02-26-2007, 05:15 PM	#1 (permalink)
Puckett guy Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Minnesota Posts: 188	Batter vs. pitcher statistics - do they mean anything in the game? My apologies if this has been previously discussed. My search of the threads did not help. OOTP tracks and provides detailed information about specific batter vs. pitcher statistics. We can debate for hours whether such statistics are or should be important to managers IRL. Certainly the broadcasters and media make a big deal about it. E.g. "(batter) has a lifetime career average against (pitcher) of only .045, you have to wonder why (manager) has not elected send up a pinch hitter in this situation." Here is my question. Other than the right and left characteristics, does OOTP in some way model that certain batters will do better (or worse) against certain pitchers? In other words, can the batter vs. pitcher stats be important for making managerial decisions, or are such stats just displaying randomnly made history? __________________ "...and we'll see you tomorrow night!" - Jack Buck, October 26, 1991, HHH Metrodome, Mpls, MN

02-26-2007, 06:24 PM	#3 (permalink)
Kaitiaki Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,062	I'm pretty sure the marketing for OOTP2006 said that some batters would do better/worse against some pitchers, but I have no statistical evidence from the game to ascertain whether or not that actually happens/is working correctly or not. - Kai __________________ BJHL: Commissioner; Owner: Wichita War Eagles

02-26-2007, 08:52 PM	#4 (permalink)
CHCfan All Star Reserve Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Lincoln, NE Posts: 852	I thought I remember Markus saying this is the case, and people (IIRC) were quite upset about this, so who knows . . . maybe he changed it. Though, to his credit, if Markus thinks something is right for the game, he'll stick with it. __________________

02-27-2007, 01:49 AM	#5 (permalink)
Curtis Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Watertown, New York Posts: 2,636	Markus did say this was a feature, in response to an observation that (I think) Waninski made about one of his hitters 'owning' a pitcher. Waninski thought it was a good thing, others thought it bad. __________________ Continuing a campaign to promote adding a 'mass select' option to Out of the Park 10. sigh

02-27-2007, 12:11 PM	#10 (permalink)
Puckett guy Minors (Double A) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Minnesota Posts: 188	What I quoted in my last post is the only comment I have found from Markus on the subject. His comment is indeed open to interpretation, but to me it indicates that he has modeled in the game that some specific batter/pitcher matchups will affect the outcome of the at bat. I speculate that this is infrequent and that there are many other factors which the game takes into account in determining the outcome. Anyway, I am going with that thought until I am proven wrong. It just seems to me that all the info in the game about batter v. pitcher stats is a waste of time and screen space if it is not in some way modeled into the game. However, those stats are typically based upon a very small sample and the manager has to keep that in mind in deciding whether they should be given any weight in making managerial decisions (which is all part of the fun). __________________ "...and we'll see you tomorrow night!" - Jack Buck, October 26, 1991, HHH Metrodome, Mpls, MN

02-26-2007, 05:34 PM	#2 (permalink)
Craig Scarborough OOTP Developments Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 398	I seriously doubt it, unless some kind of modeling was in the program to support batter/pitcher pitch preferences (that could have probably been phrased better). I can't imagine it's on a pitcher vs. batter basis, as the database required would be astronomical in size.

02-27-2007, 10:18 AM	#9 (permalink)
Craig Scarborough OOTP Developments Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 398	This might be a part of standard righties do better against lefties, groundball hitters do better against flyball pitchers (and vice versa), etc., but I doubt it's hard coded on a pitcher vs. batter basis.

02-27-2007, 04:50 PM	#12 (permalink)
Fallschirmjager Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Hamburg, Germany Posts: 3,997	Instead of batters being succesful against certain pitchers, some hitters are better against certain types of pitchers. i.e. Hitters doing better against pitchers with good control who throw alot of breaking balls Also some hitters are just plain better at hitting certain pitches. So if a pitcher relies heavily on a certain pitch a hitter could benefit __________________

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