Your trade rules human vs. AI GMs

rasnell · 07-17-2008, 07:09 AM

When you've got a mix of human and AI GM's in an online league, what are examples of your league rules for trades?

How can you assure that a human makes a fair trade offer to AI and how do you decide to execute the trade?

Raidergoo · 07-17-2008, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rasnell

When you've got a mix of human and AI GM's in an online league, what are examples of your league rules for trades?

How can you assure that a human makes a fair trade offer to AI and how do you decide to execute the trade?

There's no such beast.

If you want to permit this, only allow AI to human trade offers, and only for what the AI offers.

rasnell · 07-17-2008, 04:01 PM

There are no commissioners that allow humans to make trade offers to the AI on their forums? You can only offer trades human to human?

Just wondering if anyone had figured a good way to allow it, such as a couple owners in the other league determining if the AI was being treated fairly and confirming the trade in the best interests of baseball.

Corsairs · 07-17-2008, 04:10 PM

It's an idea that, in theory, would be a lot of fun. In practice, however, I think it would be at best extremely difficult and at worst a nightmare. Markus does a good job but - let's be honest - most humans are going to be able to swindle the pants off the AI if left to their own devices.

So now it's up to you as commissioner to pass judgment on what will and will not fly. As soon as you get into that gray area of interpretation, things get dicey. You'll likely get owners complaining loudly that it's not their fault the AI traded a stud prospect for three has-beens and demanding the trade get passed.

It's not possible all the time, but as a general rule of thumb I think it's best to steer clear of as many situations where you're making interpretive calls as you can. This would certainly qualify as one of those situations. That said, if someone out there has a system that works for them and you're absolutely sure your owners won't make a fuss over the inevitable judgment calls you'd have to make, by all means give it a go.

TribeFanInNC · 07-17-2008, 04:44 PM

I agree with Corsairs completely. I'm in a keeper rotisserie league that allows deadline dump trades that are approved by the commissioners. We've had several overturned over the years and they cause the only fights in our otherwise collegial league. We go through the same arguments every year too. It never changes. Don't allow trades with the AI. It isn't worth it.

rasnell · 07-17-2008, 10:07 PM

Good to learn this before getting into the soup.

Solonor · 07-20-2008, 10:03 AM

We do allow Human-to-AI trades in our league, but they are rare. When a human wants to trade with an AI team, they must submit the offer to the Commish (me), who doesn't run his own team and acts in the best interest of the AI team. Most of the time I get into a back-and-forth negotiation with the human GM just as if it were my team...which, since I have no team and my only concern is for the health of the league, works out fine.

We also have a trade protest rule that makes it such that the owners can overturn the Commish if they want. http://rasreth.com/baseball/SGCBLRules.htm#section304

I wouldn't consider it if the Commish runs a team. Even if he were the fairest, most honest human and never did anything wrong, there's always the appearance of bias lurking in the corner.

07-17-2008, 07:09 AM	#1 (permalink)
rasnell Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,674	Your trade rules human vs. AI GMs When you've got a mix of human and AI GM's in an online league, what are examples of your league rules for trades? How can you assure that a human makes a fair trade offer to AI and how do you decide to execute the trade? __________________ Author of new book, "Root for the Cubs: Charlie Root and the 1929 Chicago Cubs," to be published by Wind Publications and available to public by Opening Day 2009. Charlie Root is remembered for one pitch to Babe Ruth in the 1932 World Series. But baseball's biggest lie has overshadowed the career of the winningest pitcher in Cub history. Beta tester, OOTP 2007/08/09. Commissioner in fast-paced, historical Arcanum Baseball League. Member, Society for American Baseball Research.

07-17-2008, 04:01 PM	#3 (permalink)
rasnell Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,674	There are no commissioners that allow humans to make trade offers to the AI on their forums? You can only offer trades human to human? Just wondering if anyone had figured a good way to allow it, such as a couple owners in the other league determining if the AI was being treated fairly and confirming the trade in the best interests of baseball. __________________ Author of new book, "Root for the Cubs: Charlie Root and the 1929 Chicago Cubs," to be published by Wind Publications and available to public by Opening Day 2009. Charlie Root is remembered for one pitch to Babe Ruth in the 1932 World Series. But baseball's biggest lie has overshadowed the career of the winningest pitcher in Cub history. Beta tester, OOTP 2007/08/09. Commissioner in fast-paced, historical Arcanum Baseball League. Member, Society for American Baseball Research.

07-17-2008, 04:10 PM	#4 (permalink)
Corsairs Major Leagues Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 482	It's an idea that, in theory, would be a lot of fun. In practice, however, I think it would be at best extremely difficult and at worst a nightmare. Markus does a good job but - let's be honest - most humans are going to be able to swindle the pants off the AI if left to their own devices. So now it's up to you as commissioner to pass judgment on what will and will not fly. As soon as you get into that gray area of interpretation, things get dicey. You'll likely get owners complaining loudly that it's not their fault the AI traded a stud prospect for three has-beens and demanding the trade get passed. It's not possible all the time, but as a general rule of thumb I think it's best to steer clear of as many situations where you're making interpretive calls as you can. This would certainly qualify as one of those situations. That said, if someone out there has a system that works for them and you're absolutely sure your owners won't make a fuss over the inevitable judgment calls you'd have to make, by all means give it a go. __________________ Commissioner of the Planetary Extreme Baseball Alliance (PEBA) View our IOLD profile and check for openings Join PEBA or contact me for more info!

07-17-2008, 04:44 PM	#5 (permalink)
TribeFanInNC Minors (Double A) Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 121	I agree with Corsairs completely. I'm in a keeper rotisserie league that allows deadline dump trades that are approved by the commissioners. We've had several overturned over the years and they cause the only fights in our otherwise collegial league. We go through the same arguments every year too. It never changes. Don't allow trades with the AI. It isn't worth it. __________________ Dog Days Baseball: Blackwood Werewolves (retired) Career 728-415 record, 6 Larch Division titles, 1973 Kennel Cup Champions eMLB: Los Angeles Dodgers (fired) Career 161-163 record

07-17-2008, 10:07 PM	#6 (permalink)
rasnell Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 2,674	Good to learn this before getting into the soup. __________________ Author of new book, "Root for the Cubs: Charlie Root and the 1929 Chicago Cubs," to be published by Wind Publications and available to public by Opening Day 2009. Charlie Root is remembered for one pitch to Babe Ruth in the 1932 World Series. But baseball's biggest lie has overshadowed the career of the winningest pitcher in Cub history. Beta tester, OOTP 2007/08/09. Commissioner in fast-paced, historical Arcanum Baseball League. Member, Society for American Baseball Research.

07-20-2008, 10:03 AM	#7 (permalink)
Solonor Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Orlando Posts: 3,005	We do allow Human-to-AI trades in our league, but they are rare. When a human wants to trade with an AI team, they must submit the offer to the Commish (me), who doesn't run his own team and acts in the best interest of the AI team. Most of the time I get into a back-and-forth negotiation with the human GM just as if it were my team...which, since I have no team and my only concern is for the health of the league, works out fine. We also have a trade protest rule that makes it such that the owners can overturn the Commish if they want. http://rasreth.com/baseball/SGCBLRules.htm#section304 I wouldn't consider it if the Commish runs a team. Even if he were the fairest, most honest human and never did anything wrong, there's always the appearance of bias lurking in the corner. __________________ SGCBL Commissioner "Beings will come, Frodo. The one constant through all the years has been baseball. Middle Earth has rolled by like an army of Mumakil. It has been erased like a slate, rebuilt and erased again. But baseball has marked the time. This field, this game: it's a part of our past, Frodo. It reminds of us of all that once was good and it could be again. Oh... beings will come Frodo. Beings will most definitely come." - Gladden Field of Dreams Last edited by Solonor : 07-20-2008 at 10:05 AM.

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