VOTE: Time Warp HOF Ballot 1951

Matt from TN · 01-14-2005, 12:05 AM

1936 Initial Ballot Results, 1937 Results, 1938 Results, 1939 Results, 1940 Results,
1941 Results, 1942 Results, 1943 Results, 1944 Results, 1945 Results,
1946 Results, 1947 Results, 1948 Results, 1949 Results, 1950 Results

Two players were elected to the RL HOF by the BBWAA in 1951: Mel Ott and Jimmie Foxx.

All players who received at least 5% of votes on the last ballot were retained for this ballot. I also added players who became eligible for the ballot in 1951 (retired after 1945 season).

All players not receiving 5% of votes on this ballot will be removed. Also, all players who have been retired for 20 years fall off this ballot if not elected.

Vote for as many or as few as you want. Max votes are 10.

HOF Standard: 50 is considered an average HOF'er. 100 is max.

Batters

Current Career Leaders (Click to View Entire List):
AVG: .364
Hits: 4000
HR: 557
RBI: 1906
2B: 665
BB: 1962
R: 2004
SB: 1130

Willard Schwarz, C, Last Season: 1937, HOF Standard: 41
2050 H, 359 2B, 340 HR, 1399 RBI, 1106 R, 614 K, 595 BB, 14 SB, .260 AVG, .760 OPS
BOY Award: 1932
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 8
Pennants: 6
WS Victories: 5
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: SLG 1, HR 3, RBI 1, R 1
Career Top 10: HR

Glendon "Bull" Zegri, LF, Last Season: 1938, HOF Standard: 58
2934 H, 657 2B, 212 HR, 1713 RBI, 1503 R, 454 K, 1560 BB, 25 SB, .304 AVG, .844 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 2
Pennants: 4
WS Victories: NONE
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: NONE
Career Top 10: RBI, 2B, BB

Nick Graves, RF, Last Season: 1938, HOF Standard: 52
2356 H, 527 2B, 207 HR, 1408 RBI, 1208 R, 775 K, 784 BB, 110 SB, .312 AVG, .877 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: 1921
Gold Gloves: 2
Pennants: 1
WS Victories: 1
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: 2B 1
Career Top 10: NONE

Howard "Cookie" Parrish, 1B, Last Season: 1939, HOF Standard: 36
2082 H, 481 2B, 228 HR, 1171 RBI, 1010 R, 423 K, 576 BB, 6 SB, .312 AVG, .860 OPS
BOY Award: 1929, 1933
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: NONE
Pennants: 2
WS Victories: 1
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: SLG 1, OPS 1, 2B 1, RBI 1
Career Top 10: NONE

Jon Minzey, CF, Last Season: 1940, HOF Standard: 57
2988 H, 430 2B, 54 HR, 1098 RBI, 1568 R, 600 K, 710 BB, 364 SB, .316 AVG, .801 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 4
Pennants: 5
WS Victories: 2
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: 3B 1
Career Top 10: NONE

Troy Kinnear, 3B, Last Season: 1940, HOF Standard: 57
2412 H, 602 2B, 332 HR, 1595 RBI, 1423 R, 933 K, 1407 BB, 46 SB, .272 AVG, .858 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 2
Pennants: 1
WS Victories: 1
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: 2B 1, HR 1, BB 1
Career Top 10: 2B, HR

Quenton Misisca, 1B, Last Season: 1941, HOF Standard: 44
2629 H, 640 2B, 397 HR, 1787 RBI, 1419 R, 464 K, 759 BB, 26 SB, .286 AVG, .836 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 1
Pennants: 1
WS Victories: 1
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: SLG 1, 2B 1, HR 4, RBI 3
Career Top 10: HR, RBI

Harry Finley, C, Last Season: 1941, HOF Standard: 44
1982 H, 373 2B, 87 HR, 910 RBI, 1139 R, 788 K, 508 BB, 632 SB, .288 AVG, .761 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 10
Pennants: 7
WS Victories: 5
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: 3B 2
Career Top 10: NONE

Dave "Red Fox" Arkless, CF, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 55
2439 H, 401 2B, 285 HR, 1292 RBI, 1418 R, 453 K, 1036 BB, 140 SB, .297 AVG, .855 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 7
Pennants: 2
WS Victories: 1
Batting Titles: 1
Led League in: Hits 2, Runs 1
Career Top 10: NONE

Ricardo "Tiny" Bowden, SS, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 57
2510 H, 541 2B, 68 HR, 888 RBI, 1352 R, 648 K, 514 BB, 657 SB, .318 AVG, .816 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: 1928
Gold Gloves: NONE
Pennants: NONE
WS Victories: NONE
Batting Titles: 2
Led League in: Hits 1, 2B 2, 3B 1, Runs 3
Career Top 10: NONE

Adolf "The Human Torch" Greisbach, SS, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 60
2847 H, 384 2B, 53 HR, 898 RBI, 1311 R, 573 K, 1026 BB, 221 SB, .346 AVG, .853 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 1
Pennants: 1
WS Victories: 1
Batting Titles: 2
Led League in: OBP 1, Hits 4
Career Top 10: AVG

NEW

David "Pops" McAuliffe, 3B, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 55
3525 H, 596 2B, 177 HR, 1570 RBI, 1522 R, 797 K, 846 BB, 155 SB, .300 AVG, .769 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: 1923
Gold Gloves: 3
Pennants: 3
WS Victories: 1
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: NONE
Career Top 10: Hits, 2B

Mickey McWhorter, CF, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 53
2743 H, 370 2B, 76 HR, 1060 RBI, 1447 R, 970 K, 818 BB, 585 SB, .306 AVG, .771 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: NONE
Pennants: 2
WS Victories: 1
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: 3B 1
Career Top 10: NONE

Lloyd Johnson, C/1B, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 49
2494 H, 560 2B, 272 HR, 1464 RBI, 1219 R, 1059 K, 1000 BB, 14 SB, .267 AVG, .754 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 1
Pennants: 3
WS Victories: 0
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: NONE
Career Top 10: NONE

Rob "Pretty Boy" Forrestal, SS, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 46
2466 H, 455 2B, 79 HR, 1006 RBI, 1047 R, 663 K, 859 BB, 17 SB, .309 AVG, .778 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: NONE
Pennants: NONE
WS Victories: NONE
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: 2B 1
Career Top 10: NONE

Howard Sheridan, CF, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 42
2263 H, 340 2B, 291 HR, 1354 RBI, 1164 R, 505 K, 642 BB, 18 SB, .290 AVG, .804 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 1
Pennants: 3
WS Victories: 2
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: HR 1
Career Top 10: NONE

Sean Carlin, SS, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 40
2212 H, 486 2B, 101 HR, 1041 RBI, 1141 R, 571 K, 881 BB, 23 SB, .281 AVG, .765 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 1
Pennants: 2
WS Victories: 1
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: 2B 1
Career Top 10: NONE

"Big Lou" Zaitz, LF, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 38
2747 H, 392 2B, 274 HR, 1434 RBI, 1195 R, 1076 K, 574 BB, 6 SB, .302 AVG, .779 OPS
BOY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Gold Gloves: 2
Pennants: 2
WS Victories: 1
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: NONE
Career Top 10: NONE

John Storback, LF, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 22
2211 H, 270 2B, 250 HR, 1095 RBI, 994 R, 363 K, 467 BB, 11 SB, .287 AVG, .753 OPS
BOY Award: 1932
ROY Award: 1932
Gold Gloves: 4
Pennants: 1
WS Victories: NONE
Batting Titles: NONE
Led League in: HR 2, RBI 1
Career Top 10: NONE

Pitchers

Current Career Leaders (Click to View Entire List):
ERA: 2.10
W: 444
K: 3384
CG: 601
SHO: 95

"Nasty Ned" Fargo, Last Season: 1933, HOF Standard: 46
322-261, 55.2%, 3.99 ERA, 5502 IP, 1073 BB, 1482 K, 415 CG, 31 SHO, 1.24 WHIP
POY Award: 1927
ROY Award: NONE
Pennants: 1
WS Victories: 1
No-Hitters: NONE
Led League in: Wins 1, Losses 1, IP 5, CG 2
Career Top 10: NONE

Luke Riley, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 53
272-138, 66.3%, 3.34 ERA, 3746.2 IP, 967 BB, 1611 K, 350 CG, 39 SHO, 1.24 WHIP
POY Award: 1934, 1935
ROY Award: NONE
Pennants: 6
WS Victories: 5
No-Hitters: NONE
Led League in: ERA 1, WHIP 1, Wins 3, IP 1, K's 1, CG 4, SHO 2
Career Top 10: NONE

Terry Schukraft, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 51
332-255, 56.6%, 3.73 ERA, 5516.2 IP, 1764 BB, 2056 K, 428 CG, 39 SHO, 1.27 WHIP
POY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Pennants: 5
WS Victories: 4
No-Hitters: NONE
Led League in: IP 1, CG 2, SHO 1
Career Top 10: Wins

Ken "Stuffy" Zinn, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 46
283-201, 58.5%, 3.35 ERA, 4621.1 IP, 1011 BB, 1440 K, 374 CG, 35 SHO, 1.26 WHIP
POY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Pennants: 2
WS Victories: NONE
No-Hitters: NONE
Led League in: ERA 1, WHIP 1, SHO 3
Career Top 10: NONE

Art Booth, Last Season: 1944, HOF Standard: 48
284-165, 63.3%, 3.64 ERA, 4262.1 IP, 1402 BB, 1758 K, 339 CG, 30 SHO, 1.34 WHIP
POY Award: 1938, 1942
ROY Award: NONE
Pennants: 6
WS Victories: 4
No-Hitters: NONE
Led League in: ERA 2, Wins 1, IP 1, CG 1, SHO 2
Career Top 10: NONE

NEW

Mark Ponfick, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 55
334-252, 57.0%, 3.82 ERA, 5596 IP, 1184 BB, 2505 K, 463 CG, 41 SHO, 1.22 WHIP
POY Award: 1944
ROY Award: NONE
Pennants: 3
WS Victories: 2
No-Hitters: NONE
Led League in: WHIP 2, Wins 1
Career Top 10: Wins, K's, CG

Max Baxter, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 24
231-213, 52.0%, 3.94 ERA, 3988.1 IP, 1270 BB, 1675 K, 287 CG, 24 SHO, 1.35 WHIP
POY Award: NONE
ROY Award: NONE
Pennants: 4
WS Victories: 2
No-Hitters: NONE
Led League in: NONE
Career Top 10: NONE

Carlton · 01-14-2005, 12:16 AM

Schwartz
Zegri
Kinnear

Jestor · 01-14-2005, 12:30 AM

Zegri
Misisca
Ponfick

BPS · 01-14-2005, 01:02 AM

Zegri
Riley

jdw · 01-14-2005, 03:45 AM

Art Booth
Luke Riley
Terry Schukraft

John

Matt from TN · 01-14-2005, 06:37 AM

Nice to see so many early Zegri votes... Him not being in the HOF already is an utter shame.

But then there's Misisca, the #2 all-time HR leader...

and Minzey, who did nothing but hit .312 with 2988 hits and 1568 runs scored!

Why no love?!?!

Carlton · 01-14-2005, 09:10 AM

Misisca was a good HR,RBI man...but in the 20's...and yet he was only an all star 3 times, hence he was never considered the best 1B of the AL, much less baseball during his time. He was very one dimensional...moreso than his son Mo Misisca

Minzey, he only placed top 10 in triples...and those were out of whack. He was good player, not a HOFer

Kinnear on the other hand, was a good defensive 3b...losing the GG to Nonnewitz many times...and Nonnewitz was probably the best fielding 3b of TWB. He was also top ten in BB, doubles, SLG on a consistent basis.

Schwartz, despite John's malicious attack...was the catcher of the 20's and was better then his counterpart Harry Finley of the Yankees (who should be a VC vote)

lgkeeper · 01-14-2005, 09:56 AM

Zegri
Greisbach
Ponfik
Schukraft

Matt from TN · 01-14-2005, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carlton

and yet he was only an all star 3 times, hence he was never considered the best 1B of the AL, much less baseball during his time. He was very one dimensional...

The 1st AS game wasn't until 1933, so that's not a fair accusation... He almost certainly would've been to 5-6 more AS games otherwise.

And Maurice is his brother, not son.

tward13 · 01-14-2005, 10:20 AM

Zegri
Misisca
Greisbach
Kinnear
Riley
Schukraft
McAuliffe
Ponfick
L. Johnson

tward13 · 01-14-2005, 10:23 AM

McAuliffe - Guys, 3rd alltime in hits can't get you a vote?
Yes I realize that 3000 hit players are more commonplace than in real life, but 3rd!

metsgeek · 01-14-2005, 10:36 AM

Zegri
Kinnear
Minzey
Greisbach
Misisca
Finley
Arkless
McAuliffe
Ponfick
Riley

rogmax11 · 01-14-2005, 12:25 PM

Zegri
Kinnear
Greisbach
McAuliffe
Riley
Ponfick

scprideandms · 01-14-2005, 01:31 PM

Zegri
Greisbach

Dagrims · 01-14-2005, 01:50 PM

Zegri
Kinnear
Misisca
Arkless
Bowden
Greisbach
Riley
Ponfick

m0ng00se · 01-14-2005, 02:02 PM

Greisbach
Misisca
Zegri
Kinnear
Minzey
McAuliffe
Ponfick
Schukraft

Fallschirmjager · 01-14-2005, 02:10 PM

Hitters:
Zegri
Kinnear
Greisbach (why in gods name is he not already in? Carrer .420 OBP!? and 10 80+ run seasons!!! He has gotten the shaft)
Edit: I am going to add Arkless. Seven Gold Gloves at center is damn impressive and he knew how to use the stick too.

Pitchers:
Riley
Ponfick

Fallschirmjager · 01-14-2005, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tward13

McAuliffe - Guys, 3rd alltime in hits can't get you a vote?
Yes I realize that 3000 hit players are more commonplace than in real life, but 3rd!

His .OBP is only 47 points over his average and his .ops is only .770.
Out of my guys who don't get on base I expect more EBH.

jdw · 01-14-2005, 02:42 PM

> McAuliffe - Guys, 3rd alltime in
> hits can't get you a vote?
>
> Yes I realize that 3000 hit players
> are more commonplace than in
> real life, but 3rd!

Here is his placement on the Hits Leaderboards:

Hits
1927 - 189 - 4th
1929 - 193 - 9th
1930 - 204 - 4th
1931 - 182 - 9th
1938 - 188 - 2nd
1940 - 168 - 4th

So he really wasn't a great "hitman".

Well, maybe he walked a lot and had a high average in a smaller numer of AB... yeah... that could be it...

AVG
1929 - .365 - 3rd
1930 - .349 - 9th
1932 - .357 - 4th
1935 - .319 - 9th

BB
Zero

Well... maybe he was a power man!

Homeruns
1935 - 16 - 10th

It's was the 2B... I swear!

Doubles
1929 - 46 - 7th
1930 - 35 - 10th
1931 - 39 - 2nd
1932 - 36 - 10th
1937 - 35 - 10th

Er...

But he was a clutch RBI man!

RBI
1930 - 104 - 6th
1936 - 97 - 10th

Um... I mean... a Run Scorer!

Runs
1938 - 105 - 5th

Pops wasn't a great player. He got a *fulltime* major league job at the age of *17*. Because it was the mid-20s, even if you weren't fully developed, you still could get hits and what not. 134 hits as a rookie winning the ROY. He really wasn't any good that season. He held a fulltime job for the next 20 years.

Pops wasn't a *bad* player. He was perfectly okay for most of it, good a fair amount of it, and an excellent player a handful of times. But he's one of the prime examples of TWB's old "Start Playing Young, And Play Forever" mode. It was especially bad in his era.

I agree with JT/Carlton - Kinnear from the same exact era is the better player. I'm leary of all the Tigers on the ballot largely because the team won next to nothing despite some excellent hitting talent on the team. I know it's not their fault, but the guys I voted for (Booth, Riley and Schukraft) were long major contributors to the two greatest pre-live dynasties in TWB history, and packed in some great seasons.

John

jdw · 01-14-2005, 03:13 PM

On Zegri...

I should like him since he's my "type". Career .304/.401/.443/.844 so he was an OBP man. Willingness to take walks and what not, with a little bit of pop in the bat. Hey, he hit for BA as well.

The problem I have with him is that he played in a high offense era in a hitters park, and those just aren't great numbers. Despite a .304 BA, he *never* was in the Top 10 in BA. Despite being what looks like a good OBP man, he was 8-9-8-10-x-8-x-x-x-6-x-9-5 in OBP. One Top 5, and a scrattering of other Top 10s. You have to understand - *that* was the core of his game. Zero BA Top 10s. Two SLG Top 10s (8-7). And an OBP line that no one would confuse with great... *every* in his career.

RBI, you tell me?

He hit in a lineup with Slap Hertzog, Rabbi Baum and Sal Rossi *in their primes*. Your're going to drive in some runs runs HOF bad boys like that around.

Those three are in the HOF. Their top pitcher in in the HOF. Bull is closer to George Foster of the Big Red Machine. The difference is that George was better in his prime, and wasn't given a fulltime job at the age of 27.

John

01-14-2005, 12:05 AM	#1 (permalink)
Matt from TN Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In a funk.... Posts: 3,413	VOTE: Time Warp HOF Ballot 1951 1936 Initial Ballot Results, 1937 Results, 1938 Results, 1939 Results, 1940 Results, 1941 Results, 1942 Results, 1943 Results, 1944 Results, 1945 Results, 1946 Results, 1947 Results, 1948 Results, 1949 Results, 1950 Results Two players were elected to the RL HOF by the BBWAA in 1951: Mel Ott and Jimmie Foxx. All players who received at least 5% of votes on the last ballot were retained for this ballot. I also added players who became eligible for the ballot in 1951 (retired after 1945 season). All players not receiving 5% of votes on this ballot will be removed. Also, all players who have been retired for 20 years fall off this ballot if not elected. Vote for as many or as few as you want. Max votes are 10. HOF Standard: 50 is considered an average HOF'er. 100 is max. Batters Current Career Leaders (Click to View Entire List): AVG: .364 Hits: 4000 HR: 557 RBI: 1906 2B: 665 BB: 1962 R: 2004 SB: 1130 Willard Schwarz, C, Last Season: 1937, HOF Standard: 41 2050 H, 359 2B, 340 HR, 1399 RBI, 1106 R, 614 K, 595 BB, 14 SB, .260 AVG, .760 OPS BOY Award: 1932 ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 8 Pennants: 6 WS Victories: 5 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: SLG 1, HR 3, RBI 1, R 1 Career Top 10: HR Glendon "Bull" Zegri, LF, Last Season: 1938, HOF Standard: 58 2934 H, 657 2B, 212 HR, 1713 RBI, 1503 R, 454 K, 1560 BB, 25 SB, .304 AVG, .844 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 2 Pennants: 4 WS Victories: NONE Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: NONE Career Top 10: RBI, 2B, BB Nick Graves, RF, Last Season: 1938, HOF Standard: 52 2356 H, 527 2B, 207 HR, 1408 RBI, 1208 R, 775 K, 784 BB, 110 SB, .312 AVG, .877 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: 1921 Gold Gloves: 2 Pennants: 1 WS Victories: 1 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: 2B 1 Career Top 10: NONE Howard "Cookie" Parrish, 1B, Last Season: 1939, HOF Standard: 36 2082 H, 481 2B, 228 HR, 1171 RBI, 1010 R, 423 K, 576 BB, 6 SB, .312 AVG, .860 OPS BOY Award: 1929, 1933 ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: NONE Pennants: 2 WS Victories: 1 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: SLG 1, OPS 1, 2B 1, RBI 1 Career Top 10: NONE Jon Minzey, CF, Last Season: 1940, HOF Standard: 57 2988 H, 430 2B, 54 HR, 1098 RBI, 1568 R, 600 K, 710 BB, 364 SB, .316 AVG, .801 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 4 Pennants: 5 WS Victories: 2 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: 3B 1 Career Top 10: NONE Troy Kinnear, 3B, Last Season: 1940, HOF Standard: 57 2412 H, 602 2B, 332 HR, 1595 RBI, 1423 R, 933 K, 1407 BB, 46 SB, .272 AVG, .858 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 2 Pennants: 1 WS Victories: 1 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: 2B 1, HR 1, BB 1 Career Top 10: 2B, HR Quenton Misisca, 1B, Last Season: 1941, HOF Standard: 44 2629 H, 640 2B, 397 HR, 1787 RBI, 1419 R, 464 K, 759 BB, 26 SB, .286 AVG, .836 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 1 Pennants: 1 WS Victories: 1 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: SLG 1, 2B 1, HR 4, RBI 3 Career Top 10: HR, RBI Harry Finley, C, Last Season: 1941, HOF Standard: 44 1982 H, 373 2B, 87 HR, 910 RBI, 1139 R, 788 K, 508 BB, 632 SB, .288 AVG, .761 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 10 Pennants: 7 WS Victories: 5 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: 3B 2 Career Top 10: NONE Dave "Red Fox" Arkless, CF, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 55 2439 H, 401 2B, 285 HR, 1292 RBI, 1418 R, 453 K, 1036 BB, 140 SB, .297 AVG, .855 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 7 Pennants: 2 WS Victories: 1 Batting Titles: 1 Led League in: Hits 2, Runs 1 Career Top 10: NONE Ricardo "Tiny" Bowden, SS, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 57 2510 H, 541 2B, 68 HR, 888 RBI, 1352 R, 648 K, 514 BB, 657 SB, .318 AVG, .816 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: 1928 Gold Gloves: NONE Pennants: NONE WS Victories: NONE Batting Titles: 2 Led League in: Hits 1, 2B 2, 3B 1, Runs 3 Career Top 10: NONE Adolf "The Human Torch" Greisbach, SS, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 60 2847 H, 384 2B, 53 HR, 898 RBI, 1311 R, 573 K, 1026 BB, 221 SB, .346 AVG, .853 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 1 Pennants: 1 WS Victories: 1 Batting Titles: 2 Led League in: OBP 1, Hits 4 Career Top 10: AVG NEW David "Pops" McAuliffe, 3B, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 55 3525 H, 596 2B, 177 HR, 1570 RBI, 1522 R, 797 K, 846 BB, 155 SB, .300 AVG, .769 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: 1923 Gold Gloves: 3 Pennants: 3 WS Victories: 1 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: NONE Career Top 10: Hits, 2B Mickey McWhorter, CF, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 53 2743 H, 370 2B, 76 HR, 1060 RBI, 1447 R, 970 K, 818 BB, 585 SB, .306 AVG, .771 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: NONE Pennants: 2 WS Victories: 1 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: 3B 1 Career Top 10: NONE Lloyd Johnson, C/1B, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 49 2494 H, 560 2B, 272 HR, 1464 RBI, 1219 R, 1059 K, 1000 BB, 14 SB, .267 AVG, .754 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 1 Pennants: 3 WS Victories: 0 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: NONE Career Top 10: NONE Rob "Pretty Boy" Forrestal, SS, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 46 2466 H, 455 2B, 79 HR, 1006 RBI, 1047 R, 663 K, 859 BB, 17 SB, .309 AVG, .778 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: NONE Pennants: NONE WS Victories: NONE Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: 2B 1 Career Top 10: NONE Howard Sheridan, CF, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 42 2263 H, 340 2B, 291 HR, 1354 RBI, 1164 R, 505 K, 642 BB, 18 SB, .290 AVG, .804 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 1 Pennants: 3 WS Victories: 2 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: HR 1 Career Top 10: NONE Sean Carlin, SS, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 40 2212 H, 486 2B, 101 HR, 1041 RBI, 1141 R, 571 K, 881 BB, 23 SB, .281 AVG, .765 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 1 Pennants: 2 WS Victories: 1 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: 2B 1 Career Top 10: NONE "Big Lou" Zaitz, LF, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 38 2747 H, 392 2B, 274 HR, 1434 RBI, 1195 R, 1076 K, 574 BB, 6 SB, .302 AVG, .779 OPS BOY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Gold Gloves: 2 Pennants: 2 WS Victories: 1 Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: NONE Career Top 10: NONE John Storback, LF, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 22 2211 H, 270 2B, 250 HR, 1095 RBI, 994 R, 363 K, 467 BB, 11 SB, .287 AVG, .753 OPS BOY Award: 1932 ROY Award: 1932 Gold Gloves: 4 Pennants: 1 WS Victories: NONE Batting Titles: NONE Led League in: HR 2, RBI 1 Career Top 10: NONE Pitchers Current Career Leaders (Click to View Entire List): ERA: 2.10 W: 444 K: 3384 CG: 601 SHO: 95 "Nasty Ned" Fargo, Last Season: 1933, HOF Standard: 46 322-261, 55.2%, 3.99 ERA, 5502 IP, 1073 BB, 1482 K, 415 CG, 31 SHO, 1.24 WHIP POY Award: 1927 ROY Award: NONE Pennants: 1 WS Victories: 1 No-Hitters: NONE Led League in: Wins 1, Losses 1, IP 5, CG 2 Career Top 10: NONE Luke Riley, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 53 272-138, 66.3%, 3.34 ERA, 3746.2 IP, 967 BB, 1611 K, 350 CG, 39 SHO, 1.24 WHIP POY Award: 1934, 1935 ROY Award: NONE Pennants: 6 WS Victories: 5 No-Hitters: NONE Led League in: ERA 1, WHIP 1, Wins 3, IP 1, K's 1, CG 4, SHO 2 Career Top 10: NONE Terry Schukraft, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 51 332-255, 56.6%, 3.73 ERA, 5516.2 IP, 1764 BB, 2056 K, 428 CG, 39 SHO, 1.27 WHIP POY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Pennants: 5 WS Victories: 4 No-Hitters: NONE Led League in: IP 1, CG 2, SHO 1 Career Top 10: Wins Ken "Stuffy" Zinn, Last Season: 1943, HOF Standard: 46 283-201, 58.5%, 3.35 ERA, 4621.1 IP, 1011 BB, 1440 K, 374 CG, 35 SHO, 1.26 WHIP POY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Pennants: 2 WS Victories: NONE No-Hitters: NONE Led League in: ERA 1, WHIP 1, SHO 3 Career Top 10: NONE Art Booth, Last Season: 1944, HOF Standard: 48 284-165, 63.3%, 3.64 ERA, 4262.1 IP, 1402 BB, 1758 K, 339 CG, 30 SHO, 1.34 WHIP POY Award: 1938, 1942 ROY Award: NONE Pennants: 6 WS Victories: 4 No-Hitters: NONE Led League in: ERA 2, Wins 1, IP 1, CG 1, SHO 2 Career Top 10: NONE NEW Mark Ponfick, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 55 334-252, 57.0%, 3.82 ERA, 5596 IP, 1184 BB, 2505 K, 463 CG, 41 SHO, 1.22 WHIP POY Award: 1944 ROY Award: NONE Pennants: 3 WS Victories: 2 No-Hitters: NONE Led League in: WHIP 2, Wins 1 Career Top 10: Wins, K's, CG Max Baxter, Last Season: 1945, HOF Standard: 24 231-213, 52.0%, 3.94 ERA, 3988.1 IP, 1270 BB, 1675 K, 287 CG, 24 SHO, 1.35 WHIP POY Award: NONE ROY Award: NONE Pennants: 4 WS Victories: 2 No-Hitters: NONE Led League in: NONE Career Top 10: NONE

01-14-2005, 12:16 AM	#2 (permalink)
Carlton Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Troy, NY Posts: 2,561	Schwartz Zegri Kinnear __________________ "Curt's a friend of mine," Glanville said. "We used to play video games together. He killed one of my characters one time. I never forgot that."

01-14-2005, 06:37 AM	#6 (permalink)
Matt from TN Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In a funk.... Posts: 3,413	Nice to see so many early Zegri votes... Him not being in the HOF already is an utter shame. But then there's Misisca, the #2 all-time HR leader... and Minzey, who did nothing but hit .312 with 2988 hits and 1568 runs scored! Why no love?!?! __________________ List of Ancestors in Excel APLB Chicago Cubs: 1877, 1880, 1885, 1886 Champs Pro-Circuit Buffalo Merchants: 1895 Champs Set in Stone... Players Remain with Original Franchise Last edited by Matt from TN : 01-14-2005 at 06:39 AM.

01-14-2005, 09:10 AM	#7 (permalink)
Carlton Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Troy, NY Posts: 2,561	Misisca was a good HR,RBI man...but in the 20's...and yet he was only an all star 3 times, hence he was never considered the best 1B of the AL, much less baseball during his time. He was very one dimensional...moreso than his son Mo Misisca Minzey, he only placed top 10 in triples...and those were out of whack. He was good player, not a HOFer Kinnear on the other hand, was a good defensive 3b...losing the GG to Nonnewitz many times...and Nonnewitz was probably the best fielding 3b of TWB. He was also top ten in BB, doubles, SLG on a consistent basis. Schwartz, despite John's malicious attack...was the catcher of the 20's and was better then his counterpart Harry Finley of the Yankees (who should be a VC vote) __________________ "Curt's a friend of mine," Glanville said. "We used to play video games together. He killed one of my characters one time. I never forgot that." Last edited by Carlton : 01-14-2005 at 09:12 AM.

01-14-2005, 10:20 AM	#10 (permalink)
tward13 All Star Reserve Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 892	Zegri Misisca Greisbach Kinnear Riley Schukraft McAuliffe Ponfick L. Johnson __________________ Time Warp - NY Giants (1946-57) NL Champs 1951, 1952; NY Mets (1962- ) Asahi2 - NY Mets 1977 Champs PBRL - Bkn Dodgers 1922 Champs NTBL - Clev. Indians - 1921, 1922 Champs (League closed) GDBA - Phil. Athletics - 1946 Champs (League closed) MLB Replay - Det. Tigers - 1914 Champs (League closed)

01-14-2005, 01:02 AM	#4 (permalink)
BPS Minors (Triple A) Join Date: May 2004 Location: 1968 Cat Olympics Posts: 296	Zegri Riley

01-14-2005, 03:45 AM	#5 (permalink)
jdw All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 1,089	Art Booth Luke Riley Terry Schukraft John

01-14-2005, 09:56 AM	#8 (permalink)
lgkeeper All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: My front porch lookin' in Posts: 1,040	Zegri Greisbach Ponfik Schukraft

01-14-2005, 10:23 AM	#11 (permalink)
tward13 All Star Reserve Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 892	McAuliffe - Guys, 3rd alltime in hits can't get you a vote? Yes I realize that 3000 hit players are more commonplace than in real life, but 3rd! __________________ Time Warp - NY Giants (1946-57) NL Champs 1951, 1952; NY Mets (1962- ) Asahi2 - NY Mets 1977 Champs PBRL - Bkn Dodgers 1922 Champs NTBL - Clev. Indians - 1921, 1922 Champs (League closed) GDBA - Phil. Athletics - 1946 Champs (League closed) MLB Replay - Det. Tigers - 1914 Champs (League closed)

01-14-2005, 10:36 AM	#12 (permalink)
metsgeek Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Norwood, MA Posts: 5,411	Zegri Kinnear Minzey Greisbach Misisca Finley Arkless McAuliffe Ponfick Riley __________________ Commissioner - PBRL Time Warp Baseball - Boston Red Sox The Baseball Chronicle - Cleveland Spiders

01-14-2005, 12:25 PM	#13 (permalink)
rogmax11 All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 1,202	Zegri Kinnear Greisbach McAuliffe Riley Ponfick

01-14-2005, 01:31 PM	#14 (permalink)
scprideandms All Star Starter Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: N KY, 25 miles from Cincy Posts: 1,307	Zegri Greisbach __________________ Change your playground + change your playfriends + change your playtoys + change your playtime = Change your life. If you keep on doing what you've always done you'll keep on gitting what you've always gotten.

01-14-2005, 01:50 PM	#15 (permalink)
Dagrims Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 3,827	Zegri Kinnear Misisca Arkless Bowden Greisbach Riley Ponfick __________________ "Read books, get brain."

01-14-2005, 02:02 PM	#16 (permalink)
m0ng00se Major Leagues Join Date: May 2004 Location: Oregon USA Posts: 383	Greisbach Misisca Zegri Kinnear Minzey McAuliffe Ponfick Schukraft __________________ Michael AKA m0ng00se - Former TWB Detroit Tigers GM (1946-1964) Pennants: 1948, 1952, 1953, 1954, 1955, 1962, 1963, 1964 -- Titles: 1952, 1953, 1954, 1955, 1963

01-14-2005, 02:10 PM	#17 (permalink)
Fallschirmjager Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Hamburg, Germany Posts: 4,017	Hitters: Zegri Kinnear Greisbach (why in gods name is he not already in? Carrer .420 OBP!? and 10 80+ run seasons!!! He has gotten the shaft) Edit: I am going to add Arkless. Seven Gold Gloves at center is damn impressive and he knew how to use the stick too. Pitchers: Riley Ponfick __________________ Last edited by Fallschirmjager : 01-14-2005 at 02:24 PM.

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01-14-2005, 02:42 PM	#19 (permalink)
jdw All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 1,089	> McAuliffe - Guys, 3rd alltime in > hits can't get you a vote? > > Yes I realize that 3000 hit players > are more commonplace than in > real life, but 3rd! Here is his placement on the Hits Leaderboards: Hits 1927 - 189 - 4th 1929 - 193 - 9th 1930 - 204 - 4th 1931 - 182 - 9th 1938 - 188 - 2nd 1940 - 168 - 4th So he really wasn't a great "hitman". Well, maybe he walked a lot and had a high average in a smaller numer of AB... yeah... that could be it... AVG 1929 - .365 - 3rd 1930 - .349 - 9th 1932 - .357 - 4th 1935 - .319 - 9th BB Zero Well... maybe he was a power man! Homeruns 1935 - 16 - 10th It's was the 2B... I swear! Doubles 1929 - 46 - 7th 1930 - 35 - 10th 1931 - 39 - 2nd 1932 - 36 - 10th 1937 - 35 - 10th Er... But he was a clutch RBI man! RBI 1930 - 104 - 6th 1936 - 97 - 10th Um... I mean... a Run Scorer! Runs 1938 - 105 - 5th Pops wasn't a great player. He got a fulltime major league job at the age of 17. Because it was the mid-20s, even if you weren't fully developed, you still could get hits and what not. 134 hits as a rookie winning the ROY. He really wasn't any good that season. He held a fulltime job for the next 20 years. Pops wasn't a bad player. He was perfectly okay for most of it, good a fair amount of it, and an excellent player a handful of times. But he's one of the prime examples of TWB's old "Start Playing Young, And Play Forever" mode. It was especially bad in his era. I agree with JT/Carlton - Kinnear from the same exact era is the better player. I'm leary of all the Tigers on the ballot largely because the team won next to nothing despite some excellent hitting talent on the team. I know it's not their fault, but the guys I voted for (Booth, Riley and Schukraft) were long major contributors to the two greatest pre-live dynasties in TWB history, and packed in some great seasons. John

01-14-2005, 03:13 PM	#20 (permalink)
jdw All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 1,089	On Zegri... I should like him since he's my "type". Career .304/.401/.443/.844 so he was an OBP man. Willingness to take walks and what not, with a little bit of pop in the bat. Hey, he hit for BA as well. The problem I have with him is that he played in a high offense era in a hitters park, and those just aren't great numbers. Despite a .304 BA, he never was in the Top 10 in BA. Despite being what looks like a good OBP man, he was 8-9-8-10-x-8-x-x-x-6-x-9-5 in OBP. One Top 5, and a scrattering of other Top 10s. You have to understand - that was the core of his game. Zero BA Top 10s. Two SLG Top 10s (8-7). And an OBP line that no one would confuse with great... every in his career. RBI, you tell me? He hit in a lineup with Slap Hertzog, Rabbi Baum and Sal Rossi in their primes. Your're going to drive in some runs runs HOF bad boys like that around. Those three are in the HOF. Their top pitcher in in the HOF. Bull is closer to George Foster of the Big Red Machine. The difference is that George was better in his prime, and wasn't given a fulltime job at the age of 27. John