Earned Runs

Mariners · 05-18-2006, 07:26 AM

Could someone explain to me what 'Earned Runs' are and how they differ from 'Runs Allowed'? Thanks.

Cras · 05-18-2006, 09:45 AM

A run that is "earned" means the opposing team scored it without the aid of a defensive error. If a player hits a ground ball to the SS and he boots the ball, that is an error. So then if he is then batted in, he will count as an unearned run, which does not change the pitcher's ERA but will add to his total runs allowed count.

Hope that helps.

andymac · 05-18-2006, 10:03 AM

Cras has it correct.

Cras · 05-18-2006, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andymac

Fixed. Don't want to confuse the guy

.

Hey, good eye.

jm47048 · 05-18-2006, 11:04 AM

Another interesting thing to note is this:

If an error occurs with 2 outs, ALL runs from that point on till the end of the inning are not charged to ERA.

andymac · 05-18-2006, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jm47048

Another interesting thing to note is this:

If an error occurs with 2 outs, ALL runs from that point on till the end of the inning are not charged to ERA.

Yep, the basic way to think about it is "Would that run have scored if there were not any errors?" If the answer is yes, the it is an earned run. If the answer is no, then the run was unearned.

Mariners · 05-18-2006, 11:34 AM

Ok thanks for that guys, I understand ERA now.

Ruthian23 · 05-18-2006, 01:30 PM

A good example of how this works is last Sunday's White Sox vs. Twins game. The first inning played out as follows:

Shannon Stewart: Stewart singled to left center.

Luis Castillo: Castillo safe at first on Buehrle's throwing error, Stewart to second.

Mike Redmond: Redmond singled to right, Stewart scored, Castillo to third.

Torii Hunter: Hunter safe at first on shortstop Uribe's fielding error, Castillo scored, Redmond to second.

Michael Cuddyer: Cuddyer singled to left, Redmond to third, Hunter to second.

Justin Morneau: Morneau hit sacrifice fly to left, Redmond scored, Hunter to third.

Rondell White: White doubled to deep right, Hunter scored, Cuddyer to third.

Tony Batista: Batista doubled to left, Cuddyer and White scored.

Juan Castro:Castro singled to right, Batista to third.

Shannon Stewart:Stewart singled to center, Batista scored, Castro to second.

Luis Castillo: Castillo struck out on foul tip.

Mike Redmond: Redmond flied out to shallow center.

In that inning, the Twins scored seven runs off of Mark Buehrle. However, Castillo's first AB should have been out #1, but an error was made. The Redmond AB drove in an earned run, since Stewart was the one who scored, and he had reached on a single. Hunter's AB should have been the second out, but, again, an error let him reach. The Castillo run did NOT count as earned, because he reached on an error. The Morneau sacrifice fly would have been the third out. Therefore, the run that scored on the sac fly did not count as earned, nor did any of the other runs. Because of this, Buehrle managed to give up seven runs in the first inning, and only one of them was earned.

Mariners · 05-18-2006, 01:47 PM

So in that example the pitcher was 'responsible' for only one of the 7 runs in that inning! It reminds me a little of cricket, where if the wicketkeeper misses a ball that has passed the batsman any runs scored from that are counted as byes, and don't go onto runs conceded by the bowler. Thanks for that.

andymac · 05-18-2006, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mariners

So in that example the pitcher was 'responsible' for only one of the 7 runs in that inning!

Yep, if the errors hadn't occurred he would have gotten out of the inning with only that one run scoring, so that is all he is responsible for officially.

jm47048 · 05-18-2006, 03:15 PM

Another interesting thing to note:

If a relief pitcher is placed in the middle of an inning with Runner's On, he is not ERA responsible for those runners. The original pitcher in the inning who gave up those runners (assuming no erros and they were legit reaching base) would be responsible. Only in that case. If runners are one, the first pitcher of the inning can actually be charged with the loss if those runners are brought home, given that he is responsible for the possibly tieing or go ahead runs.

jm47048 · 05-18-2006, 03:16 PM

Oh sorry, the relief pitcher would not be charged with the runs, nor the loss. In fact, if he pitched no outs, and was removed, the relief pitcher would be as though he never entered the game (K's, HA not withstanding). He gets no innings (if no outs are recorded during his time on the mound) and no ERA.

andymac · 05-18-2006, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jm47048

Oh sorry, the relief pitcher would not be charged with the runs, nor the loss. In fact, if he pitched no outs, and was removed, the relief pitcher would be as though he never entered the game (K's, HA not withstanding). He gets no innings (if no outs are recorded during his time on the mound) and no ERA.

The relief pitcher is responsible for any players he allowed on-base, though. So, if he comes in and gives up a single and then gets replaced...if that guy that singled comes around to score the run will be charged to him.

jm47048 · 05-18-2006, 03:42 PM

Yes, you are correct. I only stated one case, but yes, basically if any runners are one when a pitcher leaves the game, and the pitcher that leaves the game allowed those runners (assuming no errors) then he is always responsible for those runners. And can become the pitcher of record if those runners are allowed to score.

jm47048 · 05-18-2006, 03:42 PM

lol the long long long LONG answer to the short question of this thread

05-18-2006, 07:26 AM	#1 (permalink)
Mariners Minors (Single A) Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 56	Earned Runs Could someone explain to me what 'Earned Runs' are and how they differ from 'Runs Allowed'? Thanks.

05-18-2006, 09:45 AM	#2 (permalink)
Cras Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Chicago Posts: 2,574	A run that is "earned" means the opposing team scored it without the aid of a defensive error. If a player hits a ground ball to the SS and he boots the ball, that is an error. So then if he is then batted in, he will count as an unearned run, which does not change the pitcher's ERA but will add to his total runs allowed count. Hope that helps. __________________ The Greatest Chicago Baseball Clubs Ever 1.) 2005 Chicago White Sox 2.) 1919 Chicago White Sox 3.) 1917 Chicago White Sox 4.) 1959 Chicago White Sox 5.) 1994 Chicago White Sox www.one.org Last edited by Cras : 05-18-2006 at 10:29 AM. Reason: changed with to without

05-18-2006, 10:03 AM	#3 (permalink)
andymac Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Effingham, IL Posts: 5,333	Cras has it correct. __________________ June Madness: Links FTB: andymac Last edited by andymac : 05-18-2006 at 10:54 AM.

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05-18-2006, 11:04 AM	#5 (permalink)
jm47048 All Star Starter Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,190	Another interesting thing to note is this: If an error occurs with 2 outs, ALL runs from that point on till the end of the inning are not charged to ERA.

05-18-2006, 11:34 AM	#7 (permalink)
Mariners Minors (Single A) Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 56	Ok thanks for that guys, I understand ERA now.

05-18-2006, 01:30 PM	#8 (permalink)
Ruthian23 Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 294	A good example of how this works is last Sunday's White Sox vs. Twins game. The first inning played out as follows: Shannon Stewart: Stewart singled to left center. Luis Castillo: Castillo safe at first on Buehrle's throwing error, Stewart to second. Mike Redmond: Redmond singled to right, Stewart scored, Castillo to third. Torii Hunter: Hunter safe at first on shortstop Uribe's fielding error, Castillo scored, Redmond to second. Michael Cuddyer: Cuddyer singled to left, Redmond to third, Hunter to second. Justin Morneau: Morneau hit sacrifice fly to left, Redmond scored, Hunter to third. Rondell White: White doubled to deep right, Hunter scored, Cuddyer to third. Tony Batista: Batista doubled to left, Cuddyer and White scored. Juan Castro:Castro singled to right, Batista to third. Shannon Stewart:Stewart singled to center, Batista scored, Castro to second. Luis Castillo: Castillo struck out on foul tip. Mike Redmond: Redmond flied out to shallow center. In that inning, the Twins scored seven runs off of Mark Buehrle. However, Castillo's first AB should have been out #1, but an error was made. The Redmond AB drove in an earned run, since Stewart was the one who scored, and he had reached on a single. Hunter's AB should have been the second out, but, again, an error let him reach. The Castillo run did NOT count as earned, because he reached on an error. The Morneau sacrifice fly would have been the third out. Therefore, the run that scored on the sac fly did not count as earned, nor did any of the other runs. Because of this, Buehrle managed to give up seven runs in the first inning, and only one of them was earned.

05-18-2006, 01:47 PM	#9 (permalink)
Mariners Minors (Single A) Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 56	So in that example the pitcher was 'responsible' for only one of the 7 runs in that inning! It reminds me a little of cricket, where if the wicketkeeper misses a ball that has passed the batsman any runs scored from that are counted as byes, and don't go onto runs conceded by the bowler. Thanks for that.

05-18-2006, 03:15 PM	#11 (permalink)
jm47048 All Star Starter Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,190	Another interesting thing to note: If a relief pitcher is placed in the middle of an inning with Runner's On, he is not ERA responsible for those runners. The original pitcher in the inning who gave up those runners (assuming no erros and they were legit reaching base) would be responsible. Only in that case. If runners are one, the first pitcher of the inning can actually be charged with the loss if those runners are brought home, given that he is responsible for the possibly tieing or go ahead runs.

05-18-2006, 03:16 PM	#12 (permalink)
jm47048 All Star Starter Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,190	Oh sorry, the relief pitcher would not be charged with the runs, nor the loss. In fact, if he pitched no outs, and was removed, the relief pitcher would be as though he never entered the game (K's, HA not withstanding). He gets no innings (if no outs are recorded during his time on the mound) and no ERA.

05-18-2006, 03:42 PM	#14 (permalink)
jm47048 All Star Starter Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,190	Yes, you are correct. I only stated one case, but yes, basically if any runners are one when a pitcher leaves the game, and the pitcher that leaves the game allowed those runners (assuming no errors) then he is always responsible for those runners. And can become the pitcher of record if those runners are allowed to score.

05-18-2006, 03:42 PM	#15 (permalink)
jm47048 All Star Starter Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 1,190	lol the long long long LONG answer to the short question of this thread