OOTP 2009 Community Roster Project

[CubbyFan23]

Hey all,

I know we did this a few times before and it lost a little fizzle, but I think last year we ended up getting a pretty solid roster set out there, albeit it had a ton of bugs. This year, Erich has given us a great base to work off of that has no issues (that I can see) besides needing some tweaking.

I'd like to organize a team to help out with rosters. Honestly I have no idea what I need help with but I thought I would try to organize all of our thoughts in this one thread.

Be back later with ideas.

As a side, I would like to say that I am not doing this for any personal acclaim. Erich has put so many hours into this project, it is quite amazing. I doubt I would be able to match those hours even if I started now. So it is, and will stay his roster set, but just with some third party modifications from us the roster community. He really does deserve a lot of thanks, and it hurts to see him get criticized for doing something free of charge for your enjoyment.

:endrant:

[ricobrown]

Would love to help and i'm already looking into doing a college feeder to go with the roster set that was included. I also have already input information for most of the major leagues around the world. I have the logos and everything already for all the leagues just not the roster information.

[CubbyFan23]

Sounds great.

Erich nailed the MLB ratings IMO so right now I'm going through and trying to edit all of the players who appeared on any of the projection systems (ZiPS, PECOTA, etc.) that aren't accurately represented in game, and then knock out salaries.

[NomarHits400]

Originally Posted by ricobrown

Would love to help and i'm already looking into doing a college feeder to go with the roster set that was included. I also have already input information for most of the major leagues around the world. I have the logos and everything already for all the leagues just not the roster information.

Rico

Don't know how much help I can provide- but I would LOVE to see a roster this roster set with College and/or HS Feeders. After doing one last year my only word of advice would be be careful not to try and include ALL NCAA conferences- it just bogs down too much. I think I went with 112 teams in like 12-14 of the elite conferences.

Cubby,

I'd like to help- maybe the first thing to do is start with Airmens set since he has already fixed contracts and some of the players that needed unretired (with his permission of course)....I will add that I checked the set for the precipitously dropping fielding ratings that was in my set as well as Erichs OOTP8 set and am glad to report that it is gone...So I agree this seems to be a good base to start from.

[Larry Mahnken]

I'm glad to help out, CubbyFan, PM or IM me if you want my help with anything.

[KySteveH]

Okay, this may or may not be a good idea, but I'm going to say it anyway. One of the things that happens in any of these community projects is that a version gets cobbled together by a bunch of people, then gets released, and there are error, inaccuracies, disagreements, etc. I think that a big reason for this is that there is no QA process, which seems pretty damn important for a project of this nature.

So if a chunk or work gets done on contracts, I think it would be great for a 2nd person to take a look and check the work. It's incredibly easy to make mistakes on this kind of data entry, and really hard to spot your're own mistakes.

Thoughts? And yeah, I guess I'm volunteering too.

[kagnew35]

Cubbu, have posted 4 tiimes a suggestion that possibly the best way to tackle this is by setting up an online league, setting all gm's as commssihes, each editing their own team and exporting to a resulting improved set We can use the my forums and chat room to discuss individual players where there are questions.

Ky, was posting at same time as you, see my forum/chat suggestion, we could hammer it out and have the feedback after each export. live or in forum.

[CubbyFan23]

Kagnew, I like the idea, is it feasible/would it work? I haven't worked much on the online features of the game and don't really know how that side of it works. Can you actually change ratings and then re-import?

IMO basing ratings for AAA players who haven't been done yet on something (I like PECOTA for high level plaeyrs, some don't, open to suggestions) would be a good idea instead of leaving that up to just guessing. After that, I would say that we shouldn't change the actual ratings on many other players much, but instead get positions/future ratings down since we would be editing guys in Single-A and lower.

Thoughts?

EDIT: I've already done Arizona and things look a lot better with guys in AAA who should be there. I really think that's the biggest hurdle is getting the tier between MLB players and low-level players in there.

[NomarHits400]

Originally Posted by KySteveH

Okay, this may or may not be a good idea, but I'm going to say it anyway. One of the things that happens in any of these community projects is that a version gets cobbled together by a bunch of people, then gets released, and there are error, inaccuracies, disagreements, etc. I think that a big reason for this is that there is no QA process, which seems pretty damn important for a project of this nature.

So if a chunk or work gets done on contracts, I think it would be great for a 2nd person to take a look and check the work. It's incredibly easy to make mistakes on this kind of data entry, and really hard to spot your're own mistakes.

Thoughts? And yeah, I guess I'm volunteering too.

I would agree- but getting biased ratings is a LOT better than the state of affairs the minor leaguers are in now.....I agree with Cubby- the MLB players only need minor tweaking- and most of that may not even be subjective (contracts and Uniform #'s for example). I agree it should be checked- and I also think that there should be some sort of idea on how to rate players- but we can try and normalize them from there.

[NomarHits400]

Originally Posted by CubbyFan23

Kagnew, I like the idea, is it feasible/would it work? I haven't worked much on the online features of the game and don't really know how that side of it works. Can you actually change ratings and then re-import?

IMO basing ratings for AAA players who haven't been done yet on something (I like PECOTA for high level plaeyrs, some don't, open to suggestions) would be a good idea instead of leaving that up to just guessing. After that, I would say that we shouldn't change the actual ratings on many other players much, but instead get positions/future ratings down since we would be editing guys in Single-A and lower.

Thoughts?

EDIT: I've already done Arizona and things look a lot better with guys in AAA who should be there. I really think that's the biggest hurdle is getting the tier between MLB players and low-level players in there.

Raidergoo made mention of this in another thread that he thought this wouldn't work as intended...But I have no Idea....Can anyone confirm?

[kagnew35]

Originally Posted by CubbyFan23

Kagnew, I like the idea, is it feasible/would it work? I haven't worked much on the online features of the game and don't really know how that side of it works. Can you actually change ratings and then re-import?

IMO basing ratings for AAA players who haven't been done yet on something (I like PECOTA for high level plaeyrs, some don't, open to suggestions) would be a good idea instead of leaving that up to just guessing. After that, I would say that we shouldn't change the actual ratings on many other players much, but instead get positions/future ratings down since we would be editing guys in Single-A and lower.

Thoughts?

EDIT: I've already done Arizona and things look a lot better with guys in AAA who should be there. I really think that's the biggest hurdle is getting the tier between MLB players and low-level players in there.

Cubby, have an email into Fidel, my site host on doing just this, on my site. Site is up and will set up a forum for each team for discussion.

We need to set guidelines for ratings, and find best source for salaries. With one playere doing each team, should go pretty fast, then we can make it available to the public.

[hydrostar]

Originally Posted by CubbyFan23

Sounds great.

Erich nailed the MLB ratings IMO so right now I'm going through and trying to edit all of the players who appeared on any of the projection systems (ZiPS, PECOTA, etc.) that aren't accurately represented in game, and then knock out salaries.

Thank you so much for being willing to do those modifications.

And I agree that Erich's work is very strong. I am more upset with the fact that roster creation in this game is just so difficult. It's really because the game is so deep and because it tracks so much...but it's disappointing for people who love real modern rosters.

[kagnew35]

Ok,
looks like both the MLB 2008 and the QS 2008 have same ratings, so no advantage with one over other.

I just added 3 Commishes to a test lg so looks like all can be a commish.

[Bears5122]

I'd be willing to help if anyone needed it. Not an expert on ratings, but could run simulations for you guys and put the leagues online for everyone to mull through. I could also fix positions (Soriano as a centerfielder?).

One suggestion though. Maybe it would be best to start small, fix the top 10-20 prospects first, then release it. It seems these massive projects where all the thousands of minor leaguers are added simply are overwhelming and the set wouldn't be out till OOTP 10 rolls around. Small fixes and frequent updates would be best in my opinion. It would suck to have everyone put in hundreds of hours into something that won't come out till November and no one will use (like some older sets).

[kagnew35]

Originally Posted by Bears5122

I'd be willing to help if anyone needed it. Not an expert on ratings, but could run simulations for you guys and put the leagues online for everyone to mull through.

One suggestion though. Maybe it would be best to start small, fix the top 10-20 prospects first, then release it. It seems these massive projects where all the thousands of minor leaguers are added simply are overwhelming and the set wouldn't be out till OOTP 10 rolls around. Small fixes and frequent updates would be best in my opinion. It would suck to have everyone put in hundreds of hours into something that won't come out till November and no one will use (like some older sets).

This makes sense to me, do the majors as needed and the top 20 prospects for release 1 and follow up a level at a time

[kagnew35]

Cubby, can you or Erich post rating guidelines for rest of us?

[kagnew35]

Any who would like to discuss this in real time, come in to my chat room. things move more quickly face to face.

[Bears5122]

Originally Posted by kagnew35

This makes sense to me, do the majors as needed and the top 20 prospects for release 1 and follow up a level at a time

I think that's best. I would have someone create a spreadsheet of the top 20 prospects from each organization. Make sure those are correct along with the minor leaguers. Then move on to a more complete set.

Lets face it, the majority of guys using the set couldn't name 20 minor leaguers in any organization. And most of those others have no shot at a major league career.

[RedSoxFaithful]

If we're going to do this, we need to make sure that anyone who's screwing with minor leaguers has a copy of the '08 BA Handbook, and is familiar with Sickels' blog. I also recommend the '08 Minor League Baseball Analyst as a third reference. (In fact, that last book might even be best for our purposes.)

I consider myself to be a prospect snob, so I'm totally in. (Disclaimer: I have never worked with roster sets in my life.)

[RedSoxFaithful]

This is why I really think OOTP needs a "chance to reach potential" rating. There are guys that are bigger risks than others, and at the present a guy like, say, Fabio Castillo (real high potential, real high flameout risk) is equal with, say, Tim Alderson (real high potential, low flameout risk).