2007/2008 European football thread - Page 44

Muppetus Galacticus · 11-22-2007, 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ukhotstove

I thought Croatia were a joy to watch, if I was a chairman at a football club i'd be looking at Bilic more closely in the future.

Bilic for Wigan?

Quote:

Originally Posted by bababui

If England had an Italian coach they would make it to the semi-finals of a Euro tourney and the quarters of a World Cup. They have the players but not the leadership.

Dive! Dive! Dive!

Quote:

Originally Posted by ukhotstove

MG lets be honest we shouldn't have been in that position last night anyway, drawing at home against Macadonia is a crime imo.

Oh yeah, it wasn't all about last night

ukhotstove · 11-22-2007, 04:58 AM

Must have sacked him, McLaren and the FA are going to hold seperate news conferences so can't think of why they would do that.

ukhotstove · 11-22-2007, 05:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muppetus Galacticus

Bilic for Wigan?

Nah we get Slavan Bruce his long lost backstabbing cousin.

Muppetus Galacticus · 11-22-2007, 05:03 AM

Italy 3-1 Faroe Islands - That's an FM dream score!

Muppetus Galacticus · 11-22-2007, 05:05 AM

Five minutes and the FA are already passing the buck - brilliant!

ukhotstove · 11-22-2007, 05:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muppetus Galacticus

Italy 3-1 Faroe Islands - That's an FM dream score!

Rogvi Jacobsen will go down as a legend for scoring their goal.

ukhotstove · 11-22-2007, 05:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muppetus Galacticus

Five minutes and the FA are already passing the buck - brilliant!

Their going to look into the running of the England set up hmmm wonder if they'll start with a look at themselves.

bababui · 11-22-2007, 05:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muppetus Galacticus

Italy 3-1 Faroe Islands - That's an FM dream score!

What was the Germany v San Marino score?

ukhotstove · 11-22-2007, 05:12 AM

Well i'm out, maybe i'll wake up and they will have announced Steve Bruce as new England manager and Jose will have taken the Wigan job to prove to the FA they should have chosen him for the England job

Muppetus Galacticus · 11-22-2007, 05:15 AM

Oh for the love of God, not Shearer!! Stuart Pearce should be above him

bababui · 11-22-2007, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muppetus Galacticus

Oh for the love of God, not Shearer!! Stuart Pearce should be above him

Pearce..another loser.

England need an outside manager. The problem is more in the head than in the tactics.

theasfl · 11-22-2007, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bababui

Do you actually watch the matches? It wouldnt have been 2-2 if he hadnt been in the game.

that doesnt refute what he said

Muppetus Galacticus · 11-22-2007, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muppetus Galacticus

Italy 3-1 Faroe Islands - That's an FM dream score!

The goal - http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=OOgGd8Iptzc

Eumel · 11-22-2007, 03:44 PM

*The* hero of the Faroes is still Torkil Nielsen, though:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IoTss_6KsZk

Muppetus Galacticus · 11-23-2007, 09:34 AM

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,195...899637,00.html

Quote:

Johnston insists there are major problems at the top of the sport, but it is even worse at grass-roots level where English youngsters are not working hard enough and are being outnumbered in academies by foreign talent.

He added: "It's been going wrong for 30-40 years. When Kevin Keegan was the England manager he made an amazing statement, saying English kids are lazy.

"And the reason the clubs are buying so many foreigners is because they are technically proficient. Just like the Croats the other night. They played better football and that's why they are in the European Championships and England are not.

"They can change the pace of the play because they can hold onto the ball, but English kids give the ball away.

"There is a problem at national level and that is very clear for all to see in terms of touch and feel, but more importantly there is a heart issue.

"We know English teams are best when they come from behind. Look at the rugby players, look at the cricketers when they won the Ashes. But that fighting spirit wasn't there the other night - it was only there for 10 minutes just after David Beckham came on. That was disgraceful.

"I don't know why I'm upset by this because I'm not even English, but I've lived here for 25 years and the country has given me a marvellous living.

"I'm angry, so why aren't English people more angry about what is happening at the national level and at grass roots?

[...]

"At grass roots there is a much, much bigger problem because the foreign kids are outnumbering the English kids in the academies. That is suicide. You may as well jump off a cliff now because that is wrong.

I had no idea there was a problem with the English-to-foreign ratio that far down!

Fallschirmjager · 11-23-2007, 11:40 AM

Problem is that England has never been successful at the international level.
After they invented and exported the game, from about 1930 on the rest of the world quickly developed their own game and suprassed the English.
You have some sucess very early on at the Olympics when it was amateurs from a few nations vs the English "amateurs"
1966 was the sole point of Enlgish pride and even that was something of a fluke.
Best finish in a Euro championship was 3rd

This is not a problem of that last 30-40 years
It is simply a matter of a complete lack of success throughout the entire history of English football.
Maybe it is plain bad luck, perhaps something more.
But with the title of being the inventors of the game and the level of talent that is avaliable you would expect more. And it has never been delievered on.

ukhotstove · 11-23-2007, 06:06 PM

Don't worry other nations will catch up with us as far as home grown talent is concerned, and that I mean that with the advent of Sky and the Premiership more and more non English players are playing in the top league in England and slowly other nations are catching up ie I bet there are more non German players playing for Bayern than ever before. imo in a few years time countries like Italy, Spain, Germany will face what England are going through at this moment in time and I see countries like Brazil, Argentina and the African countries being the dominant nations and because of the money in Europe I can see European nations falling behind.

ukhotstove · 11-23-2007, 06:14 PM

The main problem with the English international team is the FA itself, they appoint yes men and have done since they sacked Ramsey. imo if they had appointed better managers over the last few years we'd be talking 2 World Cup wins and 2 European Championship wins at least, it isn't the players as we have and have had the players to win things but not the managers apart from Bobby Robson. You look at managers like Keegan, Taylor, McLaren and Hoddle and none of them were or ever have been good enough to manager England.

redmarkYankees · 11-23-2007, 07:51 PM

Any of you Americans care to offer some views on Hicks and Gillett - owners of Liverpool (and various American sports teams at times)?

An extraordinarily public dispute between Liverpool manager Rafa Benitez and (mainly) Hicks, with Rafa apparently being frustrated at not being told how mych money he has to spend in January and - well, acting like a spoilt brat is about the only way to put it.

PRESS: Do you know how much you will have to spend from the American owners in January?

RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team.

Have you had any assurances you’ll have what you want?

RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team.

What about your long-term plan?

RB: My plan is training and coaching the team.

Is there anything upsetting you?

RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team.

Do you have anything to say?

RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team.

It’s clear something is up...

RB: You have my answer.

You’re very different from normal...

RB: You have my answer.

It’s clear that something is up, though. How can you focus on your training and coaching?

RB: I was preparing the training session before this Press conference. So I am always focused on training and coaching.

It’s not always possible, though...

RB: Yes, it is for me.

You said after the story linking you with Bayern Munich you were happy to stay here for a long time. Is that still the case?

RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team.

We’re not going to tease it out of you, are we? You’re not normally late for a Press conference. You were obviously preoccupied by something...

RB: Because as always I was focusing on the training session.

Is there anything you would like to say?

RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team.

You always say you are focused on training and coaching, but you usually give answers to our enquiries, so how come it’s changed suddenly?

RB: Nothing. I’m just focused on training and coaching as always.

You did kind of suggest to the TV people that you were open to possibility of the England job. Is that something we should treat seriously?

RB: It’s your decision. You never know what will happen in the future.

Were you serious when you answered it?

RB: I was serious.

It would be dereliction of our duty not to point out that one day you say you are looking to stay here a long time, then the next day you are saying who knows about England for the future. Isn’t there a contradiction between the two?

RB: The future is the future. Now, as always I am focused on training and coaching my team, so I cannot say anything else. Just to keep preparing for the next game.

You’ve always said you wanted to stay here for years and years and talked about the future here?

RB: That is true.

So, what you’re saying suggests that perhaps the future here is in question?

RB: I am focused on training and coaching my team.

So who knows?

RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team.

Are you being allowed to do that as you wish?

RB: I am focused on training and coaching my team.

Does everyone associated with the club share that opinion?

RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team.

----

http://sport.independent.co.uk/footb...cle3191561.ece

Benitez ordered to focus on the game not funds
By Ian Herbert
Published: 24 November 2007
Any lingering doubts about the state of Rafael Benitez's relationship with his club's American proprietors were removed yesterday when one of Liverpool's co-owners, Tom Hicks, publicly told the manager to put his personal frustrations about transfer budgets aside to "concentrate on the games coming up and nothing else."

That message has also been privately communicated to Benitez though, judging by Hicks' comments, the Spaniard had not revealed his irritation with it until the bizarre press conference on Thursday at which he repeated 25 times a mantra about focussing on "training and coaching my team" in an ironic swipe at the Americans' orders.

Hicks, who yesterday defended the amount of money he and co-owner George Gillett have spent at Anfield since Liverpool's Champions League final defeat in May, is clearly of the opinion that the international break has created time for Benitez's frustrations about money – especially the £17m needed to make Javier Mascherano's loan permanent – to fester. The timing of his outburst is certainly odd, since it did not immediately follow a phone call between Liverpool and America on Thursday, as has been suggested.

"We brought in some good players and spent more money than has ever been spent before at this club," Hicks said. "We now have some crucial games coming up in the Premier League, and the Champions League and we want to see if we can win these games with the players we have. This was the message we gave to Rafa recently and I think during the international break he must have grown a bit frustrated about this. We told him to concentrate on the games coming up and nothing else and I guess he didn't like that. But, for the time being, we just need to be focused on what happens on the pitch."

The message, which developed a statement issued by the Americans on the club's website on Thursday, was even less subtle than Benitez's had been and will seem extraordinary to Liverpool fans brought up on mild, acquiescent ways of David Moores. Few clubs who move towards December still undefeated in league competition have known such a public spat – but such are the expectations of Benitez and the men who have bankrolled the summer spending.

The row also stems from differences in the way the Americans and Benitez like to do business. The Spaniard, whose history of rows with club directors includes feuds with Jesus Pitarch at Valencia, likes to deal directly with the owners. However, the Americans prefer to receive requests through the Liverpool chief executive, Rick Parry, than being harangued by Benitez.

The manager, who has not seen Hicks and Gillett since Liverpool's home game against Arsenal last month, will have to wait for an answer until after Liverpool's league game against Manchester United at Anfield on 16 December. That is five days after the Champions League trip to Marseilles which may dictate whether or not Liverpool progress in that competition. "George and I will be over in mid-December and that is the time to talk about other issues," Hicks said.

Sources close to the Americans admit there is real concern about relations with Benitez, which will do little to disabuse some Liverpool fans of the growing notion that the investors –– who will saddle Liverpool with £500m of debt next month by a planned refinancing of their loan to buy the club – are not the knights in white armour they initially seemed. That said, views from the club's chatrooms yesterday suggested that there is some sympathy for Hicks, too. "Rafa can't moan before every transfer window opens that we needs money when he has been backed so far," stated one fan .

The mood when the Americans do eventually arrive will depend on results and while today's visit to Newcastle is not the easiest, Fernando Torres is expected to be restored to the side. Defender Daniel Agger – more sorely missed than anyone during Liverpool's injury-plagued autumn – is back in training and also near to a return to the side.

Fallschirmjager · 11-23-2007, 11:14 PM

If Rafa moves to Bayern I will switch my support to Werder

We don't need a team full of damn Spanish midfielders and our best players to sit 40% of the time even when healthy

11-23-2007, 11:40 AM	#876 (permalink)
Fallschirmjager Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Hamburg, Germany Posts: 4,002	Problem is that England has never been successful at the international level. After they invented and exported the game, from about 1930 on the rest of the world quickly developed their own game and suprassed the English. You have some sucess very early on at the Olympics when it was amateurs from a few nations vs the English "amateurs" 1966 was the sole point of Enlgish pride and even that was something of a fluke. Best finish in a Euro championship was 3rd This is not a problem of that last 30-40 years It is simply a matter of a complete lack of success throughout the entire history of English football. Maybe it is plain bad luck, perhaps something more. But with the title of being the inventors of the game and the level of talent that is avaliable you would expect more. And it has never been delievered on. __________________

11-23-2007, 07:51 PM	#879 (permalink)
redmarkYankees All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 1,127	Any of you Americans care to offer some views on Hicks and Gillett - owners of Liverpool (and various American sports teams at times)? An extraordinarily public dispute between Liverpool manager Rafa Benitez and (mainly) Hicks, with Rafa apparently being frustrated at not being told how mych money he has to spend in January and - well, acting like a spoilt brat is about the only way to put it. PRESS: Do you know how much you will have to spend from the American owners in January? RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team. Have you had any assurances you’ll have what you want? RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team. What about your long-term plan? RB: My plan is training and coaching the team. Is there anything upsetting you? RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team. Do you have anything to say? RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team. It’s clear something is up... RB: You have my answer. You’re very different from normal... RB: You have my answer. It’s clear that something is up, though. How can you focus on your training and coaching? RB: I was preparing the training session before this Press conference. So I am always focused on training and coaching. It’s not always possible, though... RB: Yes, it is for me. You said after the story linking you with Bayern Munich you were happy to stay here for a long time. Is that still the case? RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team. We’re not going to tease it out of you, are we? You’re not normally late for a Press conference. You were obviously preoccupied by something... RB: Because as always I was focusing on the training session. Is there anything you would like to say? RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team. You always say you are focused on training and coaching, but you usually give answers to our enquiries, so how come it’s changed suddenly? RB: Nothing. I’m just focused on training and coaching as always. You did kind of suggest to the TV people that you were open to possibility of the England job. Is that something we should treat seriously? RB: It’s your decision. You never know what will happen in the future. Were you serious when you answered it? RB: I was serious. It would be dereliction of our duty not to point out that one day you say you are looking to stay here a long time, then the next day you are saying who knows about England for the future. Isn’t there a contradiction between the two? RB: The future is the future. Now, as always I am focused on training and coaching my team, so I cannot say anything else. Just to keep preparing for the next game. You’ve always said you wanted to stay here for years and years and talked about the future here? RB: That is true. So, what you’re saying suggests that perhaps the future here is in question? RB: I am focused on training and coaching my team. So who knows? RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team. Are you being allowed to do that as you wish? RB: I am focused on training and coaching my team. Does everyone associated with the club share that opinion? RB: As always I am focused on training and coaching my team. ---- http://sport.independent.co.uk/footb...cle3191561.ece Benitez ordered to focus on the game not funds By Ian Herbert Published: 24 November 2007 Any lingering doubts about the state of Rafael Benitez's relationship with his club's American proprietors were removed yesterday when one of Liverpool's co-owners, Tom Hicks, publicly told the manager to put his personal frustrations about transfer budgets aside to "concentrate on the games coming up and nothing else." That message has also been privately communicated to Benitez though, judging by Hicks' comments, the Spaniard had not revealed his irritation with it until the bizarre press conference on Thursday at which he repeated 25 times a mantra about focussing on "training and coaching my team" in an ironic swipe at the Americans' orders. Hicks, who yesterday defended the amount of money he and co-owner George Gillett have spent at Anfield since Liverpool's Champions League final defeat in May, is clearly of the opinion that the international break has created time for Benitez's frustrations about money – especially the £17m needed to make Javier Mascherano's loan permanent – to fester. The timing of his outburst is certainly odd, since it did not immediately follow a phone call between Liverpool and America on Thursday, as has been suggested. "We brought in some good players and spent more money than has ever been spent before at this club," Hicks said. "We now have some crucial games coming up in the Premier League, and the Champions League and we want to see if we can win these games with the players we have. This was the message we gave to Rafa recently and I think during the international break he must have grown a bit frustrated about this. We told him to concentrate on the games coming up and nothing else and I guess he didn't like that. But, for the time being, we just need to be focused on what happens on the pitch." The message, which developed a statement issued by the Americans on the club's website on Thursday, was even less subtle than Benitez's had been and will seem extraordinary to Liverpool fans brought up on mild, acquiescent ways of David Moores. Few clubs who move towards December still undefeated in league competition have known such a public spat – but such are the expectations of Benitez and the men who have bankrolled the summer spending. The row also stems from differences in the way the Americans and Benitez like to do business. The Spaniard, whose history of rows with club directors includes feuds with Jesus Pitarch at Valencia, likes to deal directly with the owners. However, the Americans prefer to receive requests through the Liverpool chief executive, Rick Parry, than being harangued by Benitez. The manager, who has not seen Hicks and Gillett since Liverpool's home game against Arsenal last month, will have to wait for an answer until after Liverpool's league game against Manchester United at Anfield on 16 December. That is five days after the Champions League trip to Marseilles which may dictate whether or not Liverpool progress in that competition. "George and I will be over in mid-December and that is the time to talk about other issues," Hicks said. Sources close to the Americans admit there is real concern about relations with Benitez, which will do little to disabuse some Liverpool fans of the growing notion that the investors –– who will saddle Liverpool with £500m of debt next month by a planned refinancing of their loan to buy the club – are not the knights in white armour they initially seemed. That said, views from the club's chatrooms yesterday suggested that there is some sympathy for Hicks, too. "Rafa can't moan before every transfer window opens that we needs money when he has been backed so far," stated one fan . The mood when the Americans do eventually arrive will depend on results and while today's visit to Newcastle is not the easiest, Fernando Torres is expected to be restored to the side. Defender Daniel Agger – more sorely missed than anyone during Liverpool's injury-plagued autumn – is back in training and also near to a return to the side. __________________ In times of universal deceit, telling the truth will be a revolutionary act. George Orwell

11-23-2007, 11:14 PM	#880 (permalink)
Fallschirmjager Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Hamburg, Germany Posts: 4,002	If Rafa moves to Bayern I will switch my support to Werder We don't need a team full of damn Spanish midfielders and our best players to sit 40% of the time even when healthy __________________

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11-22-2007, 04:58 AM	#862 (permalink)
ukhotstove Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: North of England Gods Country Posts: 3,972	Must have sacked him, McLaren and the FA are going to hold seperate news conferences so can't think of why they would do that.

11-22-2007, 05:12 AM	#869 (permalink)
ukhotstove Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: North of England Gods Country Posts: 3,972	Well i'm out, maybe i'll wake up and they will have announced Steve Bruce as new England manager and Jose will have taken the Wigan job to prove to the FA they should have chosen him for the England job

11-22-2007, 03:44 PM	#874 (permalink)
Eumel Major Leagues Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Germany Posts: 422	The hero of the Faroes is still Torkil Nielsen, though: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IoTss_6KsZk

11-23-2007, 06:06 PM	#877 (permalink)
ukhotstove Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: North of England Gods Country Posts: 3,972	Don't worry other nations will catch up with us as far as home grown talent is concerned, and that I mean that with the advent of Sky and the Premiership more and more non English players are playing in the top league in England and slowly other nations are catching up ie I bet there are more non German players playing for Bayern than ever before. imo in a few years time countries like Italy, Spain, Germany will face what England are going through at this moment in time and I see countries like Brazil, Argentina and the African countries being the dominant nations and because of the money in Europe I can see European nations falling behind.

11-23-2007, 06:14 PM	#878 (permalink)
ukhotstove Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: North of England Gods Country Posts: 3,972	The main problem with the English international team is the FA itself, they appoint yes men and have done since they sacked Ramsey. imo if they had appointed better managers over the last few years we'd be talking 2 World Cup wins and 2 European Championship wins at least, it isn't the players as we have and have had the players to win things but not the managers apart from Bobby Robson. You look at managers like Keegan, Taylor, McLaren and Hoddle and none of them were or ever have been good enough to manager England.