Report: A-Rod tested positive in 2003

[Left-handed Badger]

Originally Posted by Baseball and Beans

I'm of the opinion that usage has probably gone down substantially each decade as testing has become more rigorous. That's probably not a popular opinion with science as great as it is nowadays, but I feel like the awareness of getting caught really shot it down. The steroids may be BETTER these days, but I feel like that were used a lot more often back in the day.

Depends on when back in the day is. Amphetamines were popular in the 1960s and 1970s I'd say. I doubt steroids came into baseball much until after 1980 sometime. For a long time, "bulking up" was some what frowned on in baseball. It was considered to hurt a player if the bulked up too much and the muscles got stiff and unwieldy. Baseball players didnt even weightlift all that much.

[Jason Moyer]

Originally Posted by Left-handed Badger

I doubt steroids came into baseball much until after 1980 sometime.

Other than Hank Aaron's teammate on the Braves, the one who caught 713, saying that he started taking them in the 60's along with a lot of other people?

[AirmenSmith]

Just wanted to post my thoughts on this.

I am not happy that he did steroids because I thought he was going to be the best player of all time, well next to Babe Ruth. I am not surprised by this because this is now becoming a normal thing for the good players to be cheaters. This sucks and I hope this will be the last big name to be called out. This is a another strike for baseball and they are running out of chances.

[The Professor]

Originally Posted by Left-handed Badger

Depends on when back in the day is. Amphetamines were popular in the 1960s and 1970s I'd say. I doubt steroids came into baseball much until after 1980 sometime. For a long time, "bulking up" was some what frowned on in baseball. It was considered to hurt a player if the bulked up too much and the muscles got stiff and unwieldy. Baseball players didnt even weightlift all that much.

Amphetamines were popular in the 1950s, becoming a staple of the trainer toolkit when guys came back from World War II. And they remained a staple of MLB life until very recently, if not still.

And if you (and I mean a general "you" here) believe steroids didn't crack baseball until the 1980s, you are living a dream. I'm not convinced they were extremely widespread (not like greenies), and I'm a bit skeptical of Tom House's claims as well, but with every other major sport dealing with steroids by the late 1960s, I find it highly unlikely that baseball was a decade behind its peers...even if there was an anti-lifting culture that pervaded the game.

Enhancement is as old as sport, and baseball is not exempt. Heck, you have Pud Galvin, the nineteenth century pitcher, associated with the Brown-Sequard testosterone elixir. Legal and illegal, ridiculous and sublime, players and management will try anything, especially if it is cutting edge. Uppers, downers, the Cardinals and their vitamins during the 1940s, old Clark Griffith and his carrots, and undoubtedly steroids well before 1980.

I tend to view the problem as an extension of deeper social and cultural forces instead of one that is merely an extension of villanous cheaters trying to beat the system. And I still love baseball. And I'm not inclined to moralize too much about the bad guys or the state of the game. The picture is just so much bigger than that.

Frankly, I believe baseball's greatest drug problem for all these years - and the root of many a player turning not only to speed, but also recreational drugs - has been alcohol. But, then, baseball long ago sold its very soul to the brewing industry. The boozy lifestyle of the game, the beer-soaked broadcasts, that was charming. And the money was critical.

Alcoholism in Major League Baseball, and the game's culture of drinking, has always been woefully under emphasized because alcohol happens to be legal.

[Rasmuth]

as time passes by, the more Jose Canseco's statements that everyone thought were so outlandish...seem to be vindicated.

[CMH]

First time I came across that Tom House story. I never put much thought into when steroids would have started, but the perception that it started with the Bash Brothers time period has always seemed amusing to me. Why wouldn't have guys been using it in the 70's or 60's? I'm positive guys were using something even before that.

[CMH]

Originally Posted by Rasmuth

as time passes by, the more Jose Canseco's statements that everyone thought were so outlandish...seem to be vindicated.

Canseco was clearly writing under the same system Sports Illustrated wrote their story on Alex Rodriguez.

He had sources that proved what they heard or saw, and he had personal accounts that verified other stories. Harold Reynolds on MLB Network talked about how Canseco's writing in the book seemed to be that of a guy who did his research on both steroids and provided anecdotes that were both believable and apparently true.

Canseco probably didn't think a witch hunt would be in order as a result of his book, but the face of steroids in baseball has definitely help make the public more aware of the problem.

He may not have hit his 1,000 homeruns he claims he could have had he stayed healthy. But, he did a lot more.

[Jason Moyer]

Prof, thanks for that info on Pud Galvin. I had never heard that before. Reading about it, I have this really horrible mental image of Babe Ruth downing goat testicles before games now (probably while he was corking his bat).

[His Own Bad Self]

I'm just angry. I've rooted for Rodriguez - I root for a lot of the players who get undeserved criticism for certain things (Lamar Odom, Peyton Manning, among others). Between this and his odd choices in his personal life, he's made it difficult to do that, even if "everyone else" did drugs.

I gave momentary thought to giving up on MLB. Don't know what to do, though. There's probably a lot of use in the NBA that we don't hear about, and we all know the NFL is a mess. For being so much fun to follow, sports can be immensely aggravating.

[Long_Long_Name]

I'm not really interested in all that stuff - I see it as some sort of internal problem for MLB to take care about.
The sport is still beautiful to me.

[JWay]

I just get pissed when MLB gets a bad rap from this when NFL players get caught and kids are still wearing Julius Peppers and Shawn Merriman jerseys. C'mon.

[Scoman]

Its a real shame,I kinda always thought A- Rods numbers were just to good to be true anyway,so its not a real surprise. I think MLB needs to take a harder stance on cheaters. A lifetime ban ,and a zero tolerance policy might get the players attention. MLB is equally responsible for letting it go on for so long with the knowledge that they had. Hopefully one day they will get a good commissioner with no ties to owners or players and do the right thing. But trust me I am not holding my breath.

[Skipaway]

NFL damanges the life of their players through tackling more than through steroids though.

Lots of former NFL players have mental issues and die early because of concussions. If we want to talk about health, tackling should be banned before we ban steroids.

[Skipaway]

Originally Posted by Scoman

Its a real shame,I kinda always thought A- Rods numbers were just to good to be true anyway,so its not a real surprise. I think MLB needs to take a harder stance on cheaters. A lifetime ban ,and a zero tolerance policy might get the players attention. MLB is equally responsible for letting it go on for so long with the knowledge that they had. Hopefully one day they will get a good commissioner with no ties to owners or players and do the right thing. But trust me I am not holding my breath.

MLB already has a much harsher policy comparing to other leagues.

[Scoman]

Originally Posted by Skipaway

NFL damanges the life of their players through tackling more than through steroids though.

Lots of former NFL players have mental issues and die early because of concussions. If we want to talk about health, tackling should be banned before we ban steroids.

Granted,but how do you compare the two,you know the dangers of football,hockey, boxing from the time you are a kid. Steroid use is cheating yourself, your fellow players ,and the fans. I understand your point on the dangers,but don't see how the two compare.

[Skipaway]

Originally Posted by Scoman

Granted,but how do you compare the two,you know the dangers of football,hockey, boxing from the time you are a kid. Steroid use is cheating yourself, your fellow players ,and the fans. I understand your point on the dangers,but don't see how the two compare.

There are two aspects of it.

Cheating is always a tricky subject. There is never a real clear stance on it. Some people consider it part of the game and a show of competitiveness. It's like flopping in soccer and basketball or stealing signs in all sports. Usually there is no real guideline on what kind of cheating is more tolerable than others. It's often more about traditions.

Health in general is one aspect that everybody can agree on and the base for the real need to ban steroids. Nobody banned steroids because it's cheating. Actually, if it's not banned for health reasons it wouldn't be cheating at all.

The health impact of constant contact in NFL isn't something we knew much about. You'd be wrong to say that kids know about it coming in, considering how little we know about concussions even now. Some studies on former NFL players' brains were just done lately and triggered a round of discussion in the media. People didn't know that some NFL players became depressed and started destroying their lives because of the hit they took in NFL.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/01/26/athlete.brains/

And only lately did studies show that too much kids go back into games after suffering concussion too early.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...873131,00.html

[Thundercrack]

Originally Posted by Long_Long_Name

I'm not really interested in all that stuff - I see it as some sort of internal problem for MLB to take care about.
The sport is still beautiful to me.

ahh, the ostrich approach.

[Long_Long_Name]

Originally Posted by Thundercrack

ahh, the ostrich approach.

Really? How is acknowledging that there's a problem but that MLB should take care of it the ostrich approach? I mean, seriously, to me it's like stopping to eat Toblerone because someone in the management embezzled money - I just can't tell when I'm eating my Toblerone, and while it's an important issue to the company, I don't think it impacts me, the customer, all that much - baseball is still baseball. Hey, it might even enhance it. If MLB's rules are broken, well, that's their business.

I haven't watched a MLB game in 5 years (well, ok, I've watched exactly one), and it has nothing to do with steroids. I'd like to say that I'm revolting against MLB leaving Montréal, and while that's the reason why I lost interest in MLB, well, I just can't say I'm revolting. I just haven't felt like watching it, that's all. If Montréal was still in the league and steroid use was rampant, I'd probably still be watching.

[spark240]

Originally Posted by Jason Moyer

a handful of guys who are only allowed to vote because they work in a medium that's been obsolete for over 10 years.

Which medium is that, the one that broke the Bonds story (newspaper), the one that broke this story (magazine), or the web-only outfits? BBWAA is all of these.

[Lou Wuerfelball]

I just wish for once, the players would take a stand and come clean. Be men and fess up. Mcgwire, Arod, Clemons etc etc etc, just admit it. Even Bonds. Just say yeah, I did roids. If you ask me, this would completely shift the entire focus onto the worst commish in baseball history----MR BUD SELIG. Roids + a ball wound tighter than a golfball and umpires being told to shrink the strike zone?????? Selig now acts like he is the victim. He is an opportunistic swine. Selig knew what was going on, but made the choice to ignore the problem.

I may be the only one, but if Mcgwire ever just said "yeah I used Roids", it would be all it would take to forgive him. One of my alltime favorite player is Lance Parrish. Roids???? I can't say, but man, he was ripped. Oh well, I simply can't get behind the whole the players are evil thing.