Big surprise?

[vistaman44]

Toney, Peter want Maskaev next

Rick Reeno / BoxingScene.com
The boxing world is buzzing with the prospect of a November unification bout between heavyweight champions Wladimir Klitschko of the IBF and newly crowned WBC champion Oleg Maskaev.

As soon as it was revealed that Shelly Finkel, Klitschko's manager, offered a deal to Maskaev for the Klitschko bout, the promoters for both James Toney and Samuel Peter stated that they are not going to let the bout happen, at least not with the WBC title at stake.
Not long after then-WBC champion Hasim Rahman and James Toney battled to a draw on March 18, the WBC ruled that winner would have to face the mandatory challenger Oleg Maskaev, but the winner of the Rahman-Maskaev clash would have to face Toney in the first defense.

Rather than waste time on the sidelines, Toney decided to seek a bout with top-rated contender Samuel Peter. Once a bout was set between James Toney and Samuel Peter for September, the president of the WBC, Jose Sulaiman, ruled that the winner of Toney-Peter would become the mandatory challenger to the winner of the rematch between Rahman and Maskaev.

On Sunday, Sulaiman reasserted the WBC's position that Maskaev must face the winner of Toney-Peter. Dan Goossen, promoter of James Toney, said that after Toney beats Peter, he expects his fighter to receive his title shot against Maskaev.

"It's done as far as I'm concerned. The WBC has already ruled that Maskaev has to face the winner of the fight with James (Toney) and (Samuel) Peter. That's the next fight," Goossen voiced to BoxingScene.

Ivailo Gotzev, the manager of Samuel Peter, is also going to pursue a Maskaev bout for his fighter — should Peter win.

The respective teams of Toney and Peter do not agree on much, but they do agree on one thing. If Maskaev is to go forward with the Klitschko bout in November, he should give up his WBC heavyweight title, or be stripped of the title for not complying with the WBC, which ruled that he must face the winner of Toney-Peter.

______________________

Wonder why the "contenders" seem to all want Maskaev, or maybe Lyakhovich, but not Klitschko or Valuev? Isn't it a "big surprise" we can't get a unification bout because of all the personal and alphabet agendas?
Here we go again ...

[a87star]

Personally, with Toney's age and staying in shape issues and Peter being a really green fighter, Maskaev could probably beat either one of them. I could be wrong but to me, either fight could be very winnable for Oleg.

[mh2365]

winnable yes, but with Oleg age and his questionable chin, I would have to bet on the winner of the Toney/Peter fight. I'm okay with this proposed matchup.

The big match up for next year is Valuev-Klitschko ... all others just kind of get in the way as far as I'm concerned.

[a87star]

Originally Posted by mh2365

winnable yes, but with Oleg age and his questionable chin, I would have to bet on the winner of the Toney/Peter fight. I'm okay with this proposed matchup.

The big match up for next year is Valuev-Klitschko ... all others just kind of get in the way as far as I'm concerned.

The fanboy in me is going on the ride with Oleg because he does live in my hometown of Staten Island, NY. It's nice to see someone who got KTFO by Corey Sanders, Kirk Johnson, and Goofi Whitaker all in a row and come back to win part of the HW title. Saying that I know Oleg's limitaions of being chinny and the fact he is 37 don't play into his favor and would be exciting to see him win one more time and have a fight with one of the other three champs for unification and he probably will not beat them.

[vistaman44]

Originally Posted by a87star

Personally, with Toney's age and staying in shape issues and Peter being a really green fighter, Maskaev could probably beat either one of them. I could be wrong but to me, either fight could be very winnable for Oleg.

... the "be-careful-what-you-wish-for" philosophy, eh? He obviously won't be easy pickings for either Toney or Peter -- just ask Rahman! I just want a Klitschko-Valuev unification match. As far as I'm concerned, everyone else with an alphabet strap is a contender after that.

[mh2365]

If Valuev does well against Barrett here in the states, HBO will be drooling over a PPV Heavyweight match between Valuev and Klitschko (assuming Wlad takes care of Briggs) then I think the winner could fight Sergei. In a dream world huh?

[a87star]

Originally Posted by vistaman44

... the "be-careful-what-you-wish-for" philosophy, eh? He obviously won't be easy pickings for either Toney or Peter -- just ask Rahman! I just want a Klitschko-Valuev unification match. As far as I'm concerned, everyone else with an alphabet strap is a contender after that.

I want to see a Valuev/Klits unification match, also. I could see it taking place in Germany on PPV but that probably will not take place until early/mid next year at the latest. I just think if Toney and Peter thinks Maskaev will be a cakewalk, they are wrong. Whatever happens, it will be a tough and exciting fight.

[Mr Big]

While Oleg is, on paper, the low man on the totem pole as far as the current world champs are concerned, I see him being a tough fight for either Toney or Peter. Toney doesn't have the power to test his chin, and I can see him outboxing the amateurish Peter. If James or Samuel had any guts, they would go after Wlad or Valuev. I would like to see either destroy that loudmouth Toney and send him into retirement for good!

[erickdamac]

Originally Posted by vistaman44

Toney, Peter want Maskaev next

Rick Reeno / BoxingScene.com
The boxing world is buzzing with the prospect of a November unification bout between heavyweight champions Wladimir Klitschko of the IBF and newly crowned WBC champion Oleg Maskaev.

As soon as it was revealed that Shelly Finkel, Klitschko's manager, offered a deal to Maskaev for the Klitschko bout, the promoters for both James Toney and Samuel Peter stated that they are not going to let the bout happen, at least not with the WBC title at stake.
Not long after then-WBC champion Hasim Rahman and James Toney battled to a draw on March 18, the WBC ruled that winner would have to face the mandatory challenger Oleg Maskaev, but the winner of the Rahman-Maskaev clash would have to face Toney in the first defense.

Rather than waste time on the sidelines, Toney decided to seek a bout with top-rated contender Samuel Peter. Once a bout was set between James Toney and Samuel Peter for September, the president of the WBC, Jose Sulaiman, ruled that the winner of Toney-Peter would become the mandatory challenger to the winner of the rematch between Rahman and Maskaev.

On Sunday, Sulaiman reasserted the WBC's position that Maskaev must face the winner of Toney-Peter. Dan Goossen, promoter of James Toney, said that after Toney beats Peter, he expects his fighter to receive his title shot against Maskaev.

"It's done as far as I'm concerned. The WBC has already ruled that Maskaev has to face the winner of the fight with James (Toney) and (Samuel) Peter. That's the next fight," Goossen voiced to BoxingScene.

Ivailo Gotzev, the manager of Samuel Peter, is also going to pursue a Maskaev bout for his fighter — should Peter win.

The respective teams of Toney and Peter do not agree on much, but they do agree on one thing. If Maskaev is to go forward with the Klitschko bout in November, he should give up his WBC heavyweight title, or be stripped of the title for not complying with the WBC, which ruled that he must face the winner of Toney-Peter.

______________________

Wonder why the "contenders" seem to all want Maskaev, or maybe Lyakhovich, but not Klitschko or Valuev? Isn't it a "big surprise" we can't get a unification bout because of all the personal and alphabet agendas?
Here we go again ...

Sorry to bust your bubble but this fight is for the WBC mandatory, lol so your theory makes no sense at all.

Oh yeah and Klitsko wants no part of Sergio here is the proof.

LIAKHOVICH CHALLENGES KLITSCHKO IN NOVEMBER


Press Release: With IBF heavywweight champion Wladimir Klitschko still looking to finalize his opponent for November 11, 2006, Sergei Lyakhovich, his WBO counterpart, has added his name to the short list of candidates, which includes Shannon Briggs and newly minted WBC champion Oleg Maskaev. Here is Lyakhovich's open letter to Wladimir Klitschko: I am a The White Wolf and I want some fresh meat! Stop looking for road kill! You challenged Lamon Brewster when he was lying in a hospital bed. Now you are challenging Oleg Maskaev, who just fought 12 hard rounds and needs time to heal. Does this make you brave? My promoter Don King called your manager, Shelly Finkel, three weeks ago when I was in his office in Florida and offered to make the fight, but Shelly Finkel [reportedly] said "not now, maybe later." Why not on November 11? What will change later? I believe our fight will show people who the best champion is right now. You were so eager to fight me last year, what happened now? Or maybe you are just glad you didn't, after you saw what I did to Brewster? If it is true about your "Vaseline" or some other excuses, why don't you prove it? Fight the guy who beat the guy who beat you, or are you looking for an easy way to be a champion?
Sincerely,
Sergei Liakhovich



AUGUST 18, 2006
http://boxingtalk.com/pag/article9356.html

[vistaman44]

Originally Posted by erickdamac

Sorry to bust your bubble but this fight is for the WBC mandatory, lol so your theory makes no sense at all.

My "theory" is that the alphabet bodies' mandatory challenges are strictly money makers for them and have nothing to do with what should happen, which is title unification. It has repeatedly been shown that too many mandatory challengers were undeserving of title shots because the number of belts has diluted the playing field and made it possible for those guys to get into the title picture.

I would rather see all the belts reduced to one or two at the most, and countless polls have shown that's what most of the public wants, too. To that end, I would rather see the titles unified before Toney or Peter or Holyfield or Barrett or Briggs or whoever gets a shot at the belt(s). It's mandatory in the sense that they could lose their alphabet belts, but a big man doesn't need the strap when he proves himself in the ring. The public recognizes the true champ.

Peter and Toney naturally want to stop reunification from happening for their personal agendas/goals, and the sanctioning body (the WBC in this case), also doesn't want that to happen. All of that is obvious and makes perfect sense. If there is a unification, those guys don't don't make their money, or have to wait for it.

There is also historical precedence for champions saying the heck with the alphabet boys and unifying the title. Bring on any of the four alphabet champs fighting each other before any more "mandatory challenges." That's my preference. I don't need or want more than one champion.

Will Maskaev fight the Toney-Peter winner? Sure, because he wants to keep his belt for at least one defense, and because the offer for him to fight Klitschko right away was rightly turned down by his trainer because he needs the time to heal. That's smart on his part ... and was a smart ploy by Klitsch's camp to try to get the banged up guy first, before he's ready.

I also don't blame Liakhovich for being steamed. The answer, to me, is to make offers to the three other champions and call them out publicly, as he is doing, if they won't fight him. There's historical precedence for that, too.

To that end, both of our "theories" are true and make sense.

[a87star]

Sergei has some balls! I'm glad to see someone wants to unify the titles instead of taking manditories. The only way things will clear up in the HW division is to get the champions to fight each other. When Don King had all the champions, it seemed the same thing was going on where no one with the titles wanted to face the other title holders. The HW's will always be clouded if no one wants to assure an undisputed champ.

[CONN CHRIS]

Sanctioning fees will always come first while integrity and fairness run a distant second and third. While that may have been the case for some time prior to the 80s and 90s sanctioning bodies explosion, it has become far worse through proliferation. I fear that it will never get any better.

The problem is that there is no realistic way for such a diffuse sport to coalesce and expel the bad organizations. If there were, the WBO would not have survived after they sanctioned the Duke's 'title fight' with Tomashek when Mike Williams refused to leave his dressing room. Integrity and fairness in boxing are extinct.

[CONN CHRIS]

Lol, from Boxrec's wiki on the WBO:

Trivia: In 2001 the WBO twice moved Darrin Morris up in its super-middleweight rankings, despite the fact that the fighter was dead. Morris was #7 at the time of his death and #5 when the WBO discovered its error.

[a87star]

Originally Posted by CONN CHRIS

Trivia: In 2001 the WBO twice moved Darrin Morris up in its super-middleweight rankings, despite the fact that the fighter was dead. Morris was #7 at the time of his death and #5 when the WBO discovered its error.

I remember that! It just shows that sanctioning bodies definitely have no integrity and seem to have an agenda that is detrimental to the sport. It's really a shame.

[erickdamac]

Originally Posted by vistaman44

My "theory" is that the alphabet bodies' mandatory challenges are strictly money makers for them and have nothing to do with what should happen, which is title unification. It has repeatedly been shown that too many mandatory challengers were undeserving of title shots because the number of belts has diluted the playing field and made it possible for those guys to get into the title picture.

I would rather see all the belts reduced to one or two at the most, and countless polls have shown that's what most of the public wants, too. To that end, I would rather see the titles unified before Toney or Peter or Holyfield or Barrett or Briggs or whoever gets a shot at the belt(s). It's mandatory in the sense that they could lose their alphabet belts, but a big man doesn't need the strap when he proves himself in the ring. The public recognizes the true champ.

Peter and Toney naturally want to stop reunification from happening for their personal agendas/goals, and the sanctioning body (the WBC in this case), also doesn't want that to happen. All of that is obvious and makes perfect sense. If there is a unification, those guys don't don't make their money, or have to wait for it.

There is also historical precedence for champions saying the heck with the alphabet boys and unifying the title. Bring on any of the four alphabet champs fighting each other before any more "mandatory challenges." That's my preference. I don't need or want more than one champion.

Will Maskaev fight the Toney-Peter winner? Sure, because he wants to keep his belt for at least one defense, and because the offer for him to fight Klitschko right away was rightly turned down by his trainer because he needs the time to heal. That's smart on his part ... and was a smart ploy by Klitsch's camp to try to get the banged up guy first, before he's ready.

I also don't blame Liakhovich for being steamed. The answer, to me, is to make offers to the three other champions and call them out publicly, as he is doing, if they won't fight him. There's historical precedence for that, too.

To that end, both of our "theories" are true and make sense.

At this point its not about the titles its about good fights and the best fighting the best.

Toney vs. Peter is a great match up , Waldimir have the November date, and he talking about fighting Shannon Briggs (who is not a mandatory) Instead of Sergio who is also a champion, now explain to me how is that the IBF fault? How is that the WBO fault? Because its not! Sergio is willing to fight him, and if the fight dont happen its not no one fault but Klitsko because HBO has Accepted and wants him as an opponet.

If Waldimir want to use is voluntary defense to fight someone other then another champion the blame goes on him, not the sanctioning bodies, especially if the champion at the time had a draw against the mandatory (Hasim Rahman vs. James Toney ended in a draw) so can they jus push toney to the side? IMO that would be wrong.

By the way Olge has till March to fight the winner of toney vs. Peter so he can slip in a defense from now to then which he prolly will fight in december, against Jamile Mcline.

And if you knew Serguei Lyakhovich, you would know back when the Value vs. barret fight was being made, he was scedule to fight Kevin Mcline but then said why not fight each other in which the Value camp declined, at the time Rahman already had Olge schedule so that only left Waldimir, If anything Serguie to me is the one who pushing for the unification he dumped and HBO date just for the chance to fight Klitsko even though they where already saying the shannon briggs fight was signed.

If anyone is wondering why the fight between, Wladimir and Briggs hasn't been announced it's because HBO is pushing for Sergui vs. Waldimir and Shelly Finkle is lookign to fight Olge in March instead (and Don King promotes Sergui and don and shelly do not get alone) So if anyone is standing in the way of the fight Its Shelly.

[vistaman44]

... all of that, Eric, (including the Klitschko avoiding Liakhovich part), except for the "right now it's about good fights," not titles part. The most important fights, whether they're the best matches or not, are almost always the championship bouts, and Valuev-Liakhovich or Valuev-Klitschko is the main event in the heavyweight division, regardless of who else fights. About the rest of it, I couldn't agree more.

Peter and Toney should be a good, entertaining fight. I am not a Toney fan (or any of these guys, really, except maybe Liakhovich), and I know you are, but I absolutely agree that Toney should get a shot at a title if he wins -- just not at the expense of the public's preference to see title reunification. Neither he nor any past champ nor young contender is above the overall crown. It smacks of those guys being selfish/greedy and putting themselves ahead of the game and the fans who put money in their pockets.

I am just loathe to see Ruiz/Byrd/Rahmann/Holyfield recycled or Barrett/Peter/Briggs/etc. given a shot until the reunification matches are made. The Klitschko-Liakhovich bout not happening sounds like it is Wlad's fault, but any bout not involving championship reunification for the current four champs is the alphabet bodies' and their contenders' responsibility/fault. I'd love to see them work together for the good of the public and game, but I'm too cynical after all these years of waiting to expect to see it happen.

[mh2365]

Remember all this news is coming from someone who hates Klitschko. According to Erick, Wlad has never beaten anyone, never won a fight, never fought anyone and is everything wrong with boxing.

So between this news coming from him and boxingtalk, I'd take it with a grain of salt. Erick has a problem being biased

[a87star]

I just don't believe that Wlad would duck Liahkovich. It just seems that people like to post or publish unfavorable information about Klitchsko alluding that he is soft, scared, ducking people, glass jaw, ect. A lot of fans and boxing media like to take shots at this guy for whatever reason and I don't know why but most most of the propoganda written about Wlad seems to come from the Don King camp and the casual boxing fan eats it up.

[erickdamac]

Originally Posted by mh2365

Remember all this news is coming from someone who hates Klitschko. According to Erick, Wlad has never beaten anyone, never won a fight, never fought anyone and is everything wrong with boxing.

So between this news coming from him and boxingtalk, I'd take it with a grain of salt. Erick has a problem being biased

Again MH, you have the wrong Klitsko I hate his brother not him!!! LMAO!

But the facts are the facts, im not saying its waldimir, because I know its not, its shelly finkle, he dont want to work with don, and as long as waldimir dont step in, the fight wont happen period!

[Cap]

Klitschko, Liahkovich, Maskaev and Valuev are, no matter what anyone else says, the top four heavyweights in the world right now. They should fight each other to unify the title (although I think Klitschko has the best claim to be world champ). The problem is, you need a strong promoter to bring them all together. That's problem number 1. Problem 2 is that these guys all grew up in a time when there were always many alphabet soup titles out there. They assume that each has a prestige of its own, when in fact, they do not.

It will take pressure from the media, and its willingness to ignore the ABC baloney, to help bring these four to the table. It will take a powerful promoter to make it financially worth their while to sign on the dotted line.

While all four have skills, no one of them is truly dominant. Unless, there is a young giant-killer coming up who is still off the radar, I can see all four battling each other over the next few years, even if someone can get them into the ring together.

Cap