So... Boxing...

[Y0DA55]

I don't normally post down here in the basement, but I am on a learning kick at the moment. I finished the Rocky series during Thanksgiving weekend, and became somewhat interested in this sport that I have never really given a chance (mostly because of Pay-per-Views).

However, I was watching television the other night and caught the Virgil Hill vs Valery Brudov fight and couldn't turn away. I thought the fight was live, but just found out that it was from January of this year. Either way, it was a great fight and I am glad that I sat through all twelve rounds.

Anyway, the reason I am down here is that I would like someone to explain to me the reason for all these titles. I knew the Virgil Hill won the title, but searched for a little bit to figure out which one (the regular WBA World Cruiserweight Championship). Why are there like 6,000 different titles? Wouldn't having so many kind of cheapen winning them? Why wouldn't they have more unification bouts?

I very much enjoyed what I believe was my virgin experience with boxing - I don't think I have ever watched a full match before (aside from the one earlier in the night where the guy was knocked down three times in the first round (there was a no TKO rule) but was unfit to continue after that).

[mh2365]

Honestly there is no good reason for all the titles .. they don't need them. The actual reason for them is sanctioning fees.

[CONN CHRIS]

There have been too many sanctioning bodies for a long time. Sixty years ago, New York, California and Britain were crowning 'world' champions but it is far worse today. Absurd really.

[bear]

Originally Posted by Y0DA55

I don't normally post down here in the basement, but I am on a learning kick at the moment. I finished the Rocky series during Thanksgiving weekend, and became somewhat interested in this sport that I have never really given a chance (mostly because of Pay-per-Views).

However, I was watching television the other night and caught the Virgil Hill vs Valery Brudov fight and couldn't turn away. I thought the fight was live, but just found out that it was from January of this year. Either way, it was a great fight and I am glad that I sat through all twelve rounds.

Anyway, the reason I am down here is that I would like someone to explain to me the reason for all these titles. I knew the Virgil Hill won the title, but searched for a little bit to figure out which one (the regular WBA World Cruiserweight Championship). Why are there like 6,000 different titles? Wouldn't having so many kind of cheapen winning them? Why wouldn't they have more unification bouts?

I very much enjoyed what I believe was my virgin experience with boxing - I don't think I have ever watched a full match before (aside from the one earlier in the night where the guy was knocked down three times in the first round (there was a no TKO rule) but was unfit to continue after that).

Yoda
Welcome to the sport of boxing and to our little world of zealots down in the "basement". We are a nice little community here and will be more than happy to respond to any of your questions. I just finished reading a boxing novel written by H. C. Witwer in the early 20s called Fighting Blood. Witwer's novels were made into films and were the Rockys of that era. The main character in this particular novel, Gale Galen, has won the American light-heavyweight title and his girlfriend is begging for him to retire from the the ring. Gale informed her that he wants to reach the top before he retires and that means the world championship because there are only eight weightclasses and eight champions. Alas for those days of yore when the general public could actually name every boxing world title holder because there were just eight guys on top.

As IceTea pointed out. There is no reason for all of the alphabet groups, aside from greed, and the endless quest for sanctioning and promotional fees. This has led to a plethora of alphabet groups awarding titles Willy Nilly to such worthies as heavyweight Monty Masters. (Monty had a father in law who recognized him as such--prior to Monty's divorce.) There is also a proliforation of unnecessary weight classes like super-middleweight, minimum weight, and beached whale to further confound even the most die-hard boxing fan. With the current state of affairs I'm lucky if I can name each weight class let alone title holders. (The names of the classes aren't even consistant, eg. Junior Lightweight equals Super Featherwight.) Sadly the days when I could name each champion and the top four or five contenders in each weight class live only in the memories I have of watching fights with my dad back in the fifties when I was a kid.

Bear

[Y0DA55]

So what title is considered "the best"? There's got to be one out there.

[CONN CHRIS]

Originally Posted by Y0DA55

So what title is considered "the best"? There's got to be one out there.

It all depends.

If you don't like the BCS system, you'll hate this.

For heavyweights, the IBF title held by Wlad is king in my mind. Others may argue that.

[Bronx Bomber 15]

Welcome Yoda,
It's pretty simple really: if you want to know who the "true" champion is is any weight division, pick up a copy of RING MAGAZINE and check their rankings. No sanctioning fees there, just an honest system based on what has been done in the ring. The other belts don't mean anything.
Now that the boxing bug has bit you, I have a feeling you'll be consumed by it, just as many of us have. It's a good thing really, but I'm sure your wife or significant other will disagree
Now, go fill that TIVO with fights.

[mh2365]

Ring Magazine is what many of the so called experts go by .. I think it's the only real system that goes on merit.

[bear]

I also give more credence to the Ring Rankings, that to any of the alphabet groups. Another place to go for some background and historical information is
the Cyber Boxing Zone.

http://www.cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/cyber.htm

CBZ provides a historical listing of linear champions and believes that titles are won and lost in the ring. (Alphabet boys tend to strip champions for not fighting their mandatory challengers.

If you are interested in some basic background information look for Harry Mullan's Big Book Of Boxing or Nat Fleischer's Pictoral History of Boxing. Either or both will give you a good introduction to the history of boxing. Mullan also has fine boxing encyclopedia out there. Sadly Mullan died a few years back, but a revised edition of his encyclopedia appeared a couple of years ago. That and the late Gilbert Odd's boxing Encylopedia (circa 1988) would be the next step in boxing background literature that I'd recomend.

Bear

[hamed]

Originally Posted by Y0DA55

So what title is considered "the best"? There's got to be one out there.

They're right, either Ring magazine or I decide - either way works really.

[Y0DA55]

Thanks guys. I guess I have some reading to do.

[kenyan_cheena]

Y0DA,

You should take a look down in Inside the Ropes. The dynasties that many of us have created present a much better view of what boxing should be as compared to the current, sad reality.

[lethal liberal]

You are about to enter a wonderful world of boxing. Reading is always good and watching as many fights as you can will help you learn to appreciate the ins and outs of the sport. Most of the guys on this forum are TRUE boxing fans...hardcore. I would be happy to answer any questions you have and if I dont know the answer..I guarantee that one of these guys on here will. Not bragging,but I would be willing to bet that this forum is as good as it gets when it comes to boxing knowledge. Although we all may disagree from time to time,we usually respect each others opinion enough to hear them out. As for watching boxing,go to YouTube..there is a ton of classic fights and recent fights as well. Check out a guy by the name of Rotoscope..he has tons of great fights on his page featuring some of the all-time greats. I sort of envy you in a way...wow..the hours of fun that you have ahead of you. Anyway...good luck and welcome to our forum and our sport.

[lethal liberal]

A few suggestions: Ali/Frazier trilogy,Ward/Gatti trilogy,Castillo/Corrales first fight,Hagler/Hearns,Marciano/Walcott..just a few of the great fights that you may want to start with. I would also suggest our great game,Title Bout Championship Boxing. It is fun,realistic and will let you get to know a lot about many different fighters their strengths and weaknesses. I need to shut up...dont want to overwhelm you..lol. Just enjoy.

[erickdamac]

Originally Posted by bear

Yoda
Welcome to the sport of boxing and to our little world of zealots down in the "basement". We are a nice little community here and will be more than happy to respond to any of your questions. I just finished reading a boxing novel written by H. C. Witwer in the early 20s called Fighting Blood. Witwer's novels were made into films and were the Rockys of that era. The main character in this particular novel, Gale Galen, has won the American light-heavyweight title and his girlfriend is begging for him to retire from the the ring. Gale informed her that he wants to reach the top before he retires and that means the world championship because there are only eight weightclasses and eight champions. Alas for those days of yore when the general public could actually name every boxing world title holder because there were just eight guys on top.

As IceTea pointed out. There is no reason for all of the alphabet groups, aside from greed, and the endless quest for sanctioning and promotional fees. This has led to a plethora of alphabet groups awarding titles Willy Nilly to such worthies as heavyweight Monty Masters. (Monty had a father in law who recognized him as such--prior to Monty's divorce.) There is also a proliforation of unnecessary weight classes like super-middleweight, minimum weight, and beached whale to further confound even the most die-hard boxing fan. With the current state of affairs I'm lucky if I can name each weight class let alone title holders. (The names of the classes aren't even consistant, eg. Junior Lightweight equals Super Featherwight.) Sadly the days when I could name each champion and the top four or five contenders in each weight class live only in the memories I have of watching fights with my dad back in the fifties when I was a kid.

Bear

I AM HIGHLY OFFENDED AT THIS!



LOL j/k I concur what he said! WELCOME!

[lethal liberal]

Well put Erick! How nice would it be to have only 8 divisions and 8 champs again?! Still,with all the bad points about our beloved sport..every once in a while a fight comes along that just takes your breath and makes you realize just why you love this crazy sport. My 16 year old nephew has just recently taken an interest in the sport and it is really a joy to show him video of some of the great fights and fighters that I have watched over the years. We spent over 5 hours the other night just watching fights online..lol. Enjoy YODA!

[mh2365]

Really my best advice for beginning fans is to not get caught up in who is the champ .. just watch the fights. It really doesn't matter anymore anyways, because the promoters will piss in your ear and tell you that their guy is a champ when he has lost his last 3 fights.

Just enjoy the fights that they put on and then read ring magazine for the rankings.

[javier_83]

yeah like mike saids, enjoys the fights!!!

[lethal liberal]

Originally Posted by mh2365

Really my best advice for beginning fans is to not get caught up in who is the champ .. just watch the fights. It really doesn't matter anymore anyways, because the promoters will piss in your ear and tell you that their guy is a champ when he has lost his last 3 fights.

Just enjoy the fights that they put on and then read ring magazine for the rankings.

Sound advice. Above all,just enjoy the fights.