It's Over (Pac Vs Morales) - Thoughts -

[meade95]

Heck of a fight - Morales did what he needed to do - Can't complain about the decision....but I thought it could have been a draw (that is actually how I had it scored).

Looks like we are going to have a Barrera Vs Morales IV....as well as a Pacman Vs Morales and Barrera II (fighting each of them again). Should be a great 18 months ahead with these guys -

If I had to bet.......I think Pac KO' s Barrera at 130...and beats Morales in the rematch (he'll carry the weight better and have a better understanding at 130 after tonight).

[PittPanther]

Here's what I think: Easy Money! 8-5 odds, not too shabby!

[PittPanther]

Conspiracy theories aside, I think it would make for a great re-match. However, Pac-Man needs to work on his skill and develop something more than that straight left hand. If he goes into a rematch with Morales employing the same strategy, we will see the same result.

[meade95]

Originally Posted by PittPanther

Conspiracy theories aside, I think it would make for a great re-match. However, Pac-Man needs to work on his skill and develop something more than that straight left hand. If he goes into a rematch with Morales employing the same strategy, we will see the same result.

Agree that Pac needs utilize some additional weapons...but the fact is this was a very close fight ( a draw would not have created any ruckus....people would have easily accepted it....because it was close).

So no guarantee that even with the exact same strategy that we would get the same reslut.....we could get a 115-113 for Pac next time (heck, if the headbutt doesn't cause a cut ....that could switch one round right there).

Though, I think Pac was really knocked off his game for 2 rounds after the cut....he seemed very hesitate ...

[pat]

Sad day for us (Filipinos).

[meade95]

Originally Posted by pat

Sad day for us (Filipinos).

Nah - Pat, keep your head up, Pac served you guys well - He fought a damn good fight - He kept bringing it all 12 rounds - A truly very good fight worth paying for -

And in the rematch I'll take PAC (even more so than this fight in which I thought it was a clear toss-up) -

[pat]

Originally Posted by meade95

Nah - Pat, keep your head up, Pac served you guys well - He fought a damn good fight - He kept bringing it all 12 rounds - A truly very good fight worth paying for -

And in the rematch I'll take PAC (even more so than this fight in which I thought it was a clear toss-up) -

Thanks meade, I think it's a close fight. Without the headbutt in the 5th, it could have been different but it's cool.

I guess Pac didn't attack early as he used to, maybe it's hard to gain Morales' "territory" because of his height and reach.

[PittPanther]

Originally Posted by meade95

Agree that Pac needs utilize some additional weapons...but the fact is this was a very close fight ( a draw would not have created any ruckus....people would have easily accepted it....because it was close).

So no guarantee that even with the exact same strategy that we would get the same reslut.....we could get a 115-113 for Pac next time (heck, if the headbutt doesn't cause a cut ....that could switch one round right there).

Though, I think Pac was really knocked off his game for 2 rounds after the cut....he seemed very hesitate ...

I find is sad that you don't give Eric any credit for a giant win. Here's the deal: Pac has trouble with counterpunchers. In his last two big fights (Marquez and Morales) he has 0 victories. Why? They counterpunched well.

Just because most of the public doesn't appreciate counterpunchers, don't think others aren't noticing. It's easy to say, "Hey the fight was close, Pac man was the aggressor. Could have been a draw." But on the other hand, as far as generalship and tactical superiority go, Morales was flawless. How can aggresiveness supplant that?

Pacman needs to refine his skill and not rely solely on the left hand. Being a one dimensional wrecking ball for the masses is nice, but it might not relate into wins against upper tiered talent.

There were times in that fight, several in fact, in which it seemed that Manny would be the one to go so it's not as if Morales wasn't landing power shots either. And how about the 12th? Every boxing fan in the world should applaud Morales for being a fecking wild man! What was he thinking?

We can blame a headbutt, we can blame the gloves, we can blame numerous aspects and call forth tons of theories as to why it happened, but the bottom line is that Manny is a little rough around the edges and he lost.

This is not to say that Manny couldn't be great: He absolutely could be, but he needs to get back and work on the tactical side of the sweet science in order to evolve into the fighter he can be.

[meade95]

Originally Posted by PittPanther

I find is sad that you don't give Eric any credit for a giant win. Here's the deal: Pac has trouble with counterpunchers. In his last two big fights (Marquez and Morales) he has 0 victories. Why? They counterpunched well.

Just because most of the public doesn't appreciate counterpunchers, don't think others aren't noticing. It's easy to say, "Hey the fight was close, Pac man was the aggressor. Could have been a draw." But on the other hand, as far as generalship and tactical superiority go, Morales was flawless. How can aggresiveness supplant that?

Pacman needs to refine his skill and not rely solely on the left hand. Being a one dimensional wrecking ball for the masses is nice, but it might not relate into wins against upper tiered talent.

There were times in that fight, several in fact, in which it seemed that Manny would be the one to go so it's not as if Morales wasn't landing power shots either. And how about the 12th? Every boxing fan in the world should applaud Morales for being a fecking wild man! What was he thinking?

We can blame a headbutt, we can blame the gloves, we can blame numerous aspects and call forth tons of theories as to why it happened, but the bottom line is that Manny is a little rough around the edges and he lost.

This is not to say that Manny couldn't be great: He absolutely could be, but he needs to get back and work on the tactical side of the sweet science in order to evolve into the fighter he can be.

Pitt I have never suggested taking anything away from Morales performance - Not at all - He fought a great fight - In fact that is what I have said, both guys fought a great fight -

As for counter-punching you won't find a bigger fan of that science than myself (absolutely love watching counter punchers) - Nonetheless, that fight last night was close - Pac did enough to win 5 rounds, Morales did enough to win 5 rounds and the other 2 were tough to call -

As for your suggestion that Pac can't beat the upper talent with just being left handed......Four quick points..1. He has beaten much of the top talent since he is a multi division champion 2. He beat Barrera who is definitely a top tier guy 3. He lost last night to Morales by the thinest of possible margin. 4. He doesn't just have a left hand, he has speed to burn as well, a good chin and aggression -

Both guys fought a very good fight - Morales kept the fight being fought on his terms which helped him (and is exactly what he should have done) - Pac didn't respond well to the cut and basically lost the next 2 rounds after that (thus costing himself the fight).

[meade95]

The otherside of this that all the Morales fans aren't seeing is that they keep insisting Pac is nothing but a one-dimensional propped up fighter - ...well if this is the case.....Than Morales beating him (by a razor thin) Decision doesn't show that well for Morales (in the big picture).

Especially considering Pac was moving UP in weight for this fight -

Nah, the fact is both Morales and Pac are some hell of a good fighters - Both bringing different attributes to the ring -

[mrchallenge]

So Morales beats Pac man, Pac man beats Barrera, Barrera beats Morales.........

Looks to me like a rock paper scissors. Include Manual Marquez to the mix as well. But there isn't that one dominent guy who can beat everybody else. I wonder what the Ring P4P rankings will look like after this one.

[Antonin]

It was a truly great battle! I wanted Manny to win, but I have no problem with the way the fight was scored. Erik is a great warrior and took the best Manny could dish out. I look forward to a rematch. I wish Manny had gone to the body a bit more this time around.

On a sad note, my sis-in-law in the Phils texted us and said that when Manny was cut, his mom became very upset and was rushed to the hospital, where as of this morning (night in the Phils) she was in serious condition.

[pat]

Originally Posted by Antonin

On a sad note, my sis-in-law in the Phils texted us and said that when Manny was cut, his mom became very upset and was rushed to the hospital, where as of this morning (night in the Phils) she was in serious condition.

That's really sad. Hopefully she'll be alright.

[erickdamac]

WOW GREAT fight to be seen from ringside, I had it 114-114, (11 round to pac) but It seemed like Erik was in control, Another note, anyone who dont wear boxing gloves and ****, then they cant say the gloves didn't make a diffrence, because PAC fans had stans outside to show, people how the gloves feel, the winner gloves feel like a big pillow, while the reyes are more compact.

[PittPanther]

Originally Posted by erickdamac

WOW GREAT fight to be seen from ringside, I had it 114-114, (11 round to pac) but It seemed like Erik was in control, Another note, anyone who dont wear boxing gloves and ****, then they cant say the gloves didn't make a diffrence, because PAC fans had stans outside to show, people how the gloves feel, the winner gloves feel like a big pillow, while the reyes are more compact.

Dam, Erick, I guess by what you just wrote, Roy Jones never strapped on gloves in his life.

Plus didn't you say here that he was cracking up is sparring partners while wearing them?

Anyway, I'd hate to see what Manny's face would have looked like had they used the lighter mitts. Good thing they used the heavier gloves. . .

[PittPanther]

Originally Posted by meade95

The otherside of this that all the Morales fans aren't seeing is that they keep insisting Pac is nothing but a one-dimensional propped up fighter - ...well if this is the case.....Than Morales beating him (by a razor thin) Decision doesn't show that well for Morales (in the big picture).

Especially considering Pac was moving UP in weight for this fight -

Nah, the fact is both Morales and Pac are some hell of a good fighters - Both bringing different attributes to the ring -

Paragraphs, for example like the first one of the above quoted piece, do take away from Morales' victory.

You refer to a Morales gaining the win through a razor thin margin. . .Are you taking into account the fact that Morales basically gave away the last two rounds, especially the 12th when he switched to southpaw?

Plus, you add the much anticipated excuse "He moved up in weight. . ." Please read hamed's post #11 here .

Please don't take any of this personally, I enjoy reading what you write and your views on fights. I'm just sick of the excuses for Manny and I'm disappointed when I read them on every site I surf. Even more so, I was disappointed that Manny used them at the end of the fight in his interview with Larry. Sometimes, you just get beat up. This was one of those times.

[erickdamac]

Pitt I can say **** the gloves and say it was a draw, I was a 7-5 round fight it was not a clear cut victory, Roy Jones never had a glove problem why? Because in all his fights he had on GRANT (contract) and all his opponets wear those gloves too so I guess all the gloves would feel the same lmao.

For the smaller weights it does makes a diffrence and I can name a couple fight for example, Spinks Judah I, Grant or winning cant remember, Spinks Judah 2 Reyes, Zu vs, judah Reyes, and judah didnt want those gloves, Gloves do make a big diffrence in this fight if they would have had the Reyes gloves Pac might have been kOED or he could have KOED Eirk.

[meade95]

Originally Posted by PittPanther

Paragraphs, for example like the first one of the above quoted piece, do take away from Morales' victory.

You refer to a Morales gaining the win through a razor thin margin. . .Are you taking into account the fact that Morales basically gave away the last two rounds, especially the 12th when he switched to southpaw?

Plus, you add the much anticipated excuse "He moved up in weight. . ." Please read hamed's post #11 here .

Please don't take any of this personally, I enjoy reading what you write and your views on fights. I'm just sick of the excuses for Manny and I'm disappointed when I read them on every site I surf. Even more so, I was disappointed that Manny used them at the end of the fight in his interview with Larry. Sometimes, you just get beat up. This was one of those times.

Pitt - First let me say I agree with your setiment with regard to hearing excuse after excuse - And I am in totally agreement with regard to how Manny talked after the fight - I thought it was completely wrong for him to act as if either the gloves or the headbutt (part of boxing!!) was the only reason he lost -

Totally agree with you there - when I heard Pac say those two things it made me cringe a little -

But with regard to Morales "taking the last two rounds off" - First I'm not so sure he did that ( I think he fought the best he could in rounds 11 and 12)...and secondly if he did do that (take them off) well there must be a reason for it (tired, etc) and the fight was scheduled for 12 rounds (you have to fight the full 12 - some people start slowly...but that is no excuse when it comes to the judges cards if they lose the first couple rounds).

And for the moving up in weight - It definitely has an effect - Pac is only 5'6 and it was his first time fighting at this weight - It is completely different ball game - (IMO).

[erickdamac]

And again alot of people had the fight a draw, its not like he got blown out, he trained wearing reyes gloves and fought with winning, thats got to be hard.

Erik is a warrior and he deserve all the praises in the world, But he best stay away from berra.

[PittPanther]

Originally Posted by erickdamac

And again alot of people had the fight a draw, its not like he got blown out, he trained wearing reyes gloves and fought with winning, thats got to be hard.

Erik is a warrior and he deserve all the praises in the world, But he best stay away from berra.

Personally, I'm gunning for a Barrera/Morales IV.