Alternative WWII Middleweight Champs - Page 2

djday45 · 02-18-2004, 05:11 AM

Jack,
Moore looks scarily dominant! Just a quick message to say how much I am enjoying the replay.

Rgds
Dean

Jack Robby · 02-18-2004, 09:03 AM

Dean,
Thanks. I'm a little concerned that using Moore's light heavyweight ratings (but ignoring adjustments for weight difference) may not be an accurate reflection of his abilities as a middleweight. On the one hand, it is generally recognized that he was past his prime by the time he got to fight for the light heavyweight title. On the other hand, there is some reason to believe he was a harder puncher as a light heavy than he was as a middleweight.

A contrary view would be that, as a middleweight, Archie was poor, hungry, often undertrained and forced to fight so often that it may have been difficult for him to realize his potential. In addition, since black fighters often were limited simply to fighting each other again and again there was generally an understanding that they wouldn't try to knock each other out, both out of a fraternal concern not to damage the other guy's ability to make a living in the fight game by damging his gate appeal, as well as the more self-interested motive of not having that fighter as a future opponent to keep fighting again and again (the fear being that once you knock someone out, people are less likely to pay to see you fight him again). Archie Moore alludes to this attitude in his interview contained in Peter Heller's classic oral history of the prize ring, In This Corner.

In my scenario, I'm assuming that winning the title allows Archie to fight at his light heavyweight peak while still a middleweight. If that assumption is valid, I think his dominance is not simply credible but probable.

Thanks again for the encouraging words.

-- Jack

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02-18-2004, 05:11 AM	#21 (permalink)
djday45 All Star Starter Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 1,474 Thanks: 3 Thanked 19x in 12 posts	Jack, Moore looks scarily dominant! Just a quick message to say how much I am enjoying the replay. Rgds Dean

02-18-2004, 09:03 AM	#22 (permalink)
Jack Robby Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 20 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0x in 0 posts	Dean, Thanks. I'm a little concerned that using Moore's light heavyweight ratings (but ignoring adjustments for weight difference) may not be an accurate reflection of his abilities as a middleweight. On the one hand, it is generally recognized that he was past his prime by the time he got to fight for the light heavyweight title. On the other hand, there is some reason to believe he was a harder puncher as a light heavy than he was as a middleweight. A contrary view would be that, as a middleweight, Archie was poor, hungry, often undertrained and forced to fight so often that it may have been difficult for him to realize his potential. In addition, since black fighters often were limited simply to fighting each other again and again there was generally an understanding that they wouldn't try to knock each other out, both out of a fraternal concern not to damage the other guy's ability to make a living in the fight game by damging his gate appeal, as well as the more self-interested motive of not having that fighter as a future opponent to keep fighting again and again (the fear being that once you knock someone out, people are less likely to pay to see you fight him again). Archie Moore alludes to this attitude in his interview contained in Peter Heller's classic oral history of the prize ring, In This Corner. In my scenario, I'm assuming that winning the title allows Archie to fight at his light heavyweight peak while still a middleweight. If that assumption is valid, I think his dominance is not simply credible but probable. Thanks again for the encouraging words. -- Jack